driftwoody
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Take the path closer to the edge, especially if less traveled
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Post by driftwoody on Sept 23, 2023 7:07:59 GMT -8
But be careful. Next thing you know, Moms for Liberty is going to want to rename the Grand Tetons. As I recall, that name was a French description. I doubt the "Moms" would advocate for a Native American name or the "Dolly Partons" (the famous country singer conspired on that "Rainbowland" song).
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Post by burntfoot on Sept 23, 2023 12:17:43 GMT -8
As I recall, that name was a French description. I doubt the "Moms" would advocate for a Native American name or the "Dolly Partons" (the famous country singer conspired on that "Rainbowland" song). I had to laugh. There are a pair of tree-covered hills near the Midway Geyser Basin in Yellowstone named Twin Buttes. When I worked in the park in the 1980's, they were informally referred to by park employees as the "Raquel Welch Buttes." When I went back in the 1990's after 11 years, park employees were calling them the "Dolly Parton Buttes."
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Sept 23, 2023 13:53:45 GMT -8
The town of Kelseyville in California has resisted changing its name for many years, despite being named for a murderous psychopath. But be careful. Next thing you know, Moms for Liberty is going to want to rename the Grand Tetons. As is only right!
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Post by hikerjer on Sept 24, 2023 8:00:46 GMT -8
To me, the issue is where you stop or draw the line in renaming. It seems that half the geographical and place names in the west, in my area anyway, are named after individuals of less that stellar character. While it’s true that some appropriate changes have been made i.e. Custer’s Battlefield to the Battle of the Little Big Horn, there are many more that merit a consideration of a change in name. But how to make the determination is the rub. Pretty hard to imagine our fine citizens agreeing to change the name of places like Bozeman or Custer county or even Billings.
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Travis
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WYOMING NATIVE
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Post by Travis on Sept 24, 2023 9:56:15 GMT -8
To me, the issue is where you stop or draw the line in renaming.... I could see how that might be an issue if the powers-that-be (or powers that want-to-be) were not so determined to stop progress. But as things are, I see little likelihood the renaming might go too far.
Sure, there might be some examples that are not a priority. But considering how easily and quickly Columbus himself adopted the slave trade in Native lives and thus caused the death of numerous Natives, it is difficult to imagine this process going too far in the foreseeable future.
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Post by starwalker on Sept 24, 2023 19:25:07 GMT -8
Columbus Day is no longer celebrated here in Cherokee country.
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Sept 26, 2023 6:53:35 GMT -8
To me, the issue is where you stop or draw the line in renaming. It seems that half the geographical and place names in the west, in my area anyway, are named after individuals of less that stellar character. While it’s true that some appropriate changes have been made i.e. Custer’s Battlefield to the Battle of the Little Big Horn, there are many more that merit a consideration of a change in name. But how to make the determination is the rub. Pretty hard to imagine our fine citizens agreeing to change the name of places like Bozeman or Custer county or even Billings. I've thought a fair but about this, not only because of offensive place names, but also digging into various local histories. Place names change all the time, even long-standing ones, with little public comment. Some of the biggest towns in my region don't have the names they were born with, and that seems true of many other areas, too. The road my grandparents lived on for 60 changed from one innocuous word to another. The town name in my postal address changed for no apparent reason. It seems like an illogical change, because the Post Office is not located in the municipality designated by the new name, but is about 100 yards from the town hall of the original name.
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Sept 26, 2023 7:42:47 GMT -8
I've also pondered the oddity of obsolete town names living on in the names of roads that lead to the renamed towns. For example, Deckertown Road goes to Sussex, and Drakestown Road goes to Succasunna.
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RumiDude
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Post by RumiDude on Sept 26, 2023 8:09:06 GMT -8
I've also pondered the oddity of obsolete town names living on in the names of roads that lead to the renamed towns. For example, Deckertown Road goes to Sussex, and Drakestown Road goes to Succasunna. Where I lived along the confluence of the Missouri, Illinois, and Mississippi rivers, with several other rivers that also emptied into the river system, many roads were named after the ferries that they accessed. Most of those ferries no longer exist, yet the roads retain the names. Of course, this hass nothing to do with the thread topic, but is interesting nonetheless. Rumi
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reuben
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Post by reuben on Sept 26, 2023 10:46:25 GMT -8
Of course, this hass nothing to do with the thread topic, but is interesting nonetheless. Rumi Rumi <~~~~~ the off-topic dude
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Sept 26, 2023 14:42:46 GMT -8
I've also pondered the oddity of obsolete town names living on in the names of roads that lead to the renamed towns. For example, Deckertown Road goes to Sussex, and Drakestown Road goes to Succasunna. Where I lived along the confluence of the Missouri, Illinois, and Mississippi rivers, with several other rivers that also emptied into the river system, many roads were named after the ferries that they accessed. Most of those ferries no longer exist, yet the roads retain the names. Of course, this hass nothing to do with the thread topic, but is interesting nonetheless. Rumi A similar phenomenon in the East and especially Southeast are roads named for long-gone mills.
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RumiDude
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Post by RumiDude on Sept 27, 2023 7:26:01 GMT -8
King County, the most populated county in Washington containing Seattle, was named for William King, the vice president under President Pierce. He was a slave owning Southern Democrat. In 2005 or so King County "renamed" itself after Martin Luther King in order to undo the connection with slavery. To be sure, most people are oblivious to the entire association with William King as well as the "change" that was enacted. Official letter heads remained the same.
Rumi
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Sept 27, 2023 18:54:36 GMT -8
RumiDude, I always thought that was a very elegant solution to the problem.
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TrailElder
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Something will have gone out of us as a people if we ever let the remaining wilderness be destroyed
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Post by TrailElder on Oct 3, 2023 5:46:46 GMT -8
Really interesting point about place names changing and evolving over time BigLoad . I wonder how that went in some of the first people cultures. I gather lots of flux there too. Place names and oral language were differently important. And tribes had different names for the same place. I make up personal names for places all the time, often for places that have names on a map, and almost certainly called something else by the locals. Rodeo Canyon. Firefly Meadow. Dunk Your Face Rapid (named after a beer and you-know-what). [See footnote story.] I wonder if it was sort of like that, and if they had any kind of formal process for naming important places. In the "white" dominant culture there has been a standardization over time -- the mapping era, of course, being the crux. He who makes the maps.... I wonder what that evolution looked like in earlier cultures. It's been interesting to be involved in a couple of these restorative naming projects. In the case of Blue Sky, the term is very meaningful to both the Northern and Southern Cheyenne, but it means different things to each, and some variance even within tribes. There was tension between the tribes on what name to use. As far as I can tell, in this case the impetus for the rename came from the tribes themselves -- I think more so the Southern Cheyenne. In the case of the Gore Range rename to the Nuchu, which means "We The People," there were many options for what they actually called themselves, who "they" actual were (bands within tribes, for example), and discussion about it all still goes on. (None of the history is in writing, of course, so ongoing discussion is the mode.) As far as I can tell, the flame for this rename was lit originally by local white people and has been taken forward by Ute tribal leaders, most of whom are no longer local to the range, which was once an important homeland. I was able to speak with one of them at a gathering for the Blue Sky rename and he was very passionate that Nuchu would be the next! FOOTNOTE STORY: I was running Westwater on the Colorado years ago, and the people I was with had run it the year before and stopped to cliff jump from a point where you can jump from about 15 feet, or climb up to jump from 40+... Their friend had jumped from the high point the year before and landed feet first with his legs apart. Shattered his pelvis. They had to float him out to the waiting helicopter. When we were there they took us up to look down from the spot where he had jumped. While we were up there a ranger in a boat came by and shouted up to us, "You're not going to jump from there are you?" Hell no, they said, it didn't work out too well last year for our friend. "Oh, that was you guys? We call that BUSTED BALLS POINT now!"
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TrailElder
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Something will have gone out of us as a people if we ever let the remaining wilderness be destroyed
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Post by TrailElder on Nov 16, 2023 4:50:15 GMT -8
The November agenda of the Colorado Geographic Naming Advisory Board. Getting things done.
The November meeting includes required annual Board member training, updates of outstanding renaming recommendations: Redskin Mountain to Mount Jerome (USBGN Case 5153), Redskin Creek to Ute Creek in Park and Jefferson counties (USBGN Case 5038), Negro Draw to Robinson Draw in Montezuma County (USBGN Case 5557), Dead Mexican Gulch to Jose Belardi Gulch in Garfield County (USBGN Case 5765) and introducing Kit Carson Mountain to Frustum Peak in Saguache County (USBGN Case 5480).
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