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Post by hangingtrekker on Jul 11, 2016 4:28:19 GMT -8
JRinGeorgia - I will have to try that one. I dont have any of those bottle pumps though and my ketchup stock is full at the moment. Maybe my neighbors have some in a bottle like that...
Filters must be getting better and better. The one I first used was back in 2006-2007. I recall, even a clean filter, had resistance pumping, enough to make it a chore. We rotated pumping our own water so no one person was stuck with "pump duties". Having gravity filters that work just by water flowing through them under the pressure of its own weight, nothing more, is pretty wild. If it works that is wonderful.
With the Sawyer/Sawyer Mini filters - I am sure you could home brew an elevated gravity system with them. Someone mentioned you could do that with the squeeze bags, but it would take a long time. If you had a way to get a bigger water supply to it setting it up in camp like that wouldn't be so bad - let it work while camp is set up.
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mk
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North Texas
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Post by mk on Jul 11, 2016 5:17:42 GMT -8
Do you have pictures of the break/repair by chance? I don't have a photo, unfortunately. Basically, though, the tube broke at the bottom where it attaches to the filter outlet. The tube just slides onto the end, and I think that it was bent under pressure a couple of times to where it just ripped. It tore pretty cleanly, so I just slid it back on and we taped around it so that it wouldn't bend at that point again. The tube is really flexible and my plan is to get a replacement to take along on the next trip -- just in case. I'm also storing it in the house with the rest of our more sensitive gear so that it isn't exposed to extreme heat for extended periods of time. Hope this helps!
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texasbb
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Post by texasbb on Jul 11, 2016 5:47:08 GMT -8
Those that have found the Sweetwater reliable - are you taking exceptionally good care of it? I've taken exceptionally good care of mine and had two that failed. I always pump slowly so as not to overdo the pressures, I cleaned them regularly, I never dropped them, never froze them, etc. Knowing how many people swear by them (it's why I bought the first one and went with it again after the first failure), I suspect it's a manufacturing thing--you either get a good one that'll last forever or a bad one that'll start leaking after a few trips. I'm sorry to have been scared off, too, because I really like the filter otherwise.
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Post by hangingtrekker on Jul 11, 2016 16:31:49 GMT -8
I don't have a photo, unfortunately. Basically, though, the tube broke at the bottom where it attaches to the filter outlet. The tube just slides onto the end, and I think that it was bent under pressure a couple of times to where it just ripped. It tore pretty cleanly, so I just slid it back on and we taped around it so that it wouldn't bend at that point again. The tube is really flexible and my plan is to get a replacement to take along on the next trip -- just in case. I'm also storing it in the house with the rest of our more sensitive gear so that it isn't exposed to extreme heat for extended periods of time. Hope this helps! Yep that helps. I am pretty sure I understand what you're saying. I did a quick search on pictures of that set up and it appears the filter cap has a barbed fitting the hose slides on to as you say. I will pay attention to it. If that is all that is possible for use/transportation type damage (aside from poking holes in the bag) that is good - field repairable even if it isn't a clean break just cut the left over hose clean, cut the broken end off the barb, and re-insert. The hose would be shorter but still usable. Knowing how many people swear by them (it's why I bought the first one and went with it again after the first failure), I suspect it's a manufacturing thing--you either get a good one that'll last forever or a bad one that'll start leaking after a few trips. Thanks for the info. Yeah, I can see going through a couple of those and feeling a bit burned. Was there any support/backing from MSR?
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texasbb
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Post by texasbb on Jul 11, 2016 19:12:11 GMT -8
Thanks for the info. Yeah, I can see going through a couple of those and feeling a bit burned. Was there any support/backing from MSR? Didn't check with MSR, but REI is always behind their stuff.
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mk
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Post by mk on Jul 12, 2016 18:43:42 GMT -8
field repairable even if it isn't a clean break just cut the left over hose clean, cut the broken end off the barb, and re-insert. The hose would be shorter but still usable. Exactly! We did transport the whole thing in the zippered bag that is included. It keeps it all together and protected in your pack. Especially important for the tubing, I think.
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talus
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Post by talus on Jul 13, 2016 3:41:53 GMT -8
Sawyer Squeeze or Mini. Squeeze has a better flow, Mini can be used inline on a bladder for a zero hassle system. The only thing is that they must be kept from freezing.
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Post by hangingtrekker on Jul 13, 2016 4:46:29 GMT -8
I was discussing the water scenario with my hiking buddy for this next trip. He has something called a "life straw" he is wanting to bring. He's looking for another method to compare for his son. I suggested the Sawyer or Sawyer Mini. I didn't give much thought to the squeeze. From the pictures on the webpage it looks like it can work the same way as the regular Sawyer/Sawyer Mini's with the bags. I wouldn't use it in-line with my bladder, and neither my buddy or his son have a bladder anyway, so our drinking containers are just for clean water. If there is a way to put it in-line on a bladder hose then I assume it wouldn't be hard to turn it in to a gravity filter, either. Thoughts?
On a side note - with the Katadyn gravity systems - I see they have an attachment for the hose that is a carbon/charcoal filter. Is that a decent accessory? Has anyone used another brand/supplier carbon/charcoal filter with decent results?
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talus
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Post by talus on Jul 14, 2016 9:19:02 GMT -8
Here's a link to an easy to set up gravity rig with a Sawyer: you tube link
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Post by hangingtrekker on Jul 14, 2016 18:33:33 GMT -8
Thanks for the video there talus. That is a neat rig. I don't have any of the platypus bags, or any bags with the pop bottle type cap/port. That may be something to acquire and add to my collection.
It looks like the sawyer mini has the same threads on it. Both the mini and squeeze look like the same philosophy. Though, the squeeze being bigger would probably filter water faster under its own weight than would the mini.
The limitation of the filtering in that set up (gravity) is how big of containers you use for the dirty and clean water.
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almostthere
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Post by almostthere on Jul 17, 2016 8:30:34 GMT -8
Most any of the filters on the market are going to do the job against the more common critters in the water in the wilderness. We don't often mention all the things that filters don't do, however, so I'll just put this here. Filters (and purifiers, they are not the same thing) do NOT take out chemicals. They do not remove salt or toxins. They do not do anything other than nullify or remove the organisms if any are present, and they do not always improve taste (though some have activated carbon elements that can help). They will clog in cruddy water. Say, glacial silt - I was at a river this past week, in Alaska, and it was necessary to have a container with which to settle out the sediments - this can also be true in, say, the Grand Canyon, where the river/streams can run red with sediment. Boiling is still the most effective way to purify water. A woman on my last group trip expressed surprise that I dipped out water from a creek and boiled it, without first filtering -- I told her that filtering is unnecessary if you are going to boil it. I have filtered then heated water -- to save fuel, since tea or coffee doesn't require boiling water to make it. For rehydrating the water is best boiled. You'll want to understand water sources in the area you are visiting, to understand what you need to do about water. In some places -- where there has been mining activity, where agricultural is going on upstream of you, where there are perhaps other special considerations -- you may want to just carry enough water, either for the duration of the trip or to get to the next "clean" source to filter. All filters have their best uses. I have a Hiker Pro - the second of two, the out quick connect cracked irreparably on the first one without warning - for some trips, a gravity filter (home grown with a Platypus Cleanstream unit spliced in the line), a Sawyer Mini (for day trips). When processing water for big groups a big gravity filter can be easiest. Hang it full in camp and you have a water source for everyone, with no need to trample a trail back and forth to the creek. Those life straw things? A guy on the last trip had one. He carried no water. We saw ONE river the whole day. He wanted to hang out and drink and drink and drink because he had no water with him, thought he was going to see more than one water source -- and didn't. You can't filter up a bunch of water and store it with a life straw. All filters can clog. All filters can break. All filters should be kept from freezing at night when you are out in the wilderness. Some can be stored in the freezer after drying (ceramic units instruct you to do this) and some are more resistant than others to it if you get the water out of the chamber (leave water in the Hiker Pro and it can be damaged, evacuate all the water and it's less likely to be damaged by cold). My backup plan is a handful of MicroPur and boiling -- my backup to the backup is to drink the water anyway. The things that can make you ill will set in long after you return to town. Survival is more important, and the odds are fair you'll not get sick anyway. I do filter all the time, because I go all the time and that increases my odds in a different way -- but there is a large proportion of the population that are carriers already, who never have symptoms, and I may very well be one. And yet I still take precautions, because I am a woefully prone to beating odds kind of person.... I get my wilderness permit checked often, I get my bear can checked often, I get my fishing permit checked from time to time, and if I speed I get a ticket, unlike the rest of the world, apparently. SO I don't push my luck any more than necessary.
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almostthere
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Post by almostthere on Jul 17, 2016 8:39:17 GMT -8
It looks like the sawyer mini has the same threads on it. Both the mini and squeeze look like the same philosophy. Though, the squeeze being bigger would probably filter water faster under its own weight than would the mini. The limitation of the filtering in that set up (gravity) is how big of containers you use for the dirty and clean water. I have both the Squeeze and a Mini. The Mini can be used inline, and your hydration bladder can be the "dirty" container. Or you can use it as a gravity filter, or just squeeze water through. The Squeeze needs attachments to do additional functions like that (more weight). Mine is SLOWER than the mini in a gravity application -- you're thinking larger means more water through it, but it's more complicated than that. Despite backflushing the Squeeze I have is much slower. Why is that a limitation? You can refill the containers. I do it often. My usual routine is get to camp, fill the gravity filter, refill all the bottles/bladders for tomorrow, and refill it to provide water around camp. The one who empties it gets to take it back for a refill. In the morning we pack up and go. Next day get to camp and same routine. We rarely have to use the gravity filter en route.
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Post by hangingtrekker on Jul 17, 2016 19:20:47 GMT -8
Thanks for the info almostthere. Good stuff.
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Post by amydiercon on Jul 21, 2016 22:20:19 GMT -8
There are a lot of outdoor water filters in the market, different types, sizes and use ways(pump, gravity,squeeze etc.). Lifestraw, Sawyer, MSR, Katadyn are well-known water filters. How about these outdoor water filters made in China? Maybe you can have more and better choices.
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Ed
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Post by Ed on Jul 22, 2016 5:06:14 GMT -8
From "amydiercon" website:
" The Diercon company is the world-leading manufacturer for portable water treatment (outdoor and household), with a market share exceeding 70 percent in China. As the expert of portable water filtration system, we are specialized in the R&D, manufacture and sale of high-quality products. And Diercon is the first company who has obtained both the Certificate of Water Quality Association Gold Seal and the official approval of China National Ministry of Health."
Kind of an interested party in water filter discussions...
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