rebeccad
Trail Wise!
Writing like a maniac
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Post by rebeccad on Apr 23, 2016 20:24:03 GMT -8
Never read Into the Wild. The whole premise sounded like a kid with issues and too self-centered to deal with them. Into Thin Air fascinated me because of both the nature of the disaster, and the way the book dug into the cause.
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Post by Sleeping Bag Man! on Apr 23, 2016 20:47:36 GMT -8
The whole premise sounded like a kid with issues and too self-centered to deal with them. Why would that stop you from reading it? It is a tragedy. Folks have been writing those since ancient Greece. |
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rebeccad
Trail Wise!
Writing like a maniac
Posts: 12,708
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Post by rebeccad on Apr 23, 2016 21:26:06 GMT -8
*Is* it a tragedy when it's just an immature guy doing something stupid? I don't know; maybe so. You could say the same about Romeo and Juliet. For whatever reasons, I've never been inspired to want to read about him. |
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Post by cloudwalker on Apr 23, 2016 21:41:28 GMT -8
Well both are tragedies, the only difference is that the "main" character survives in one and not the other.  Note: have not read "Into the Wild" |
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Post by Sleeping Bag Man! on Apr 23, 2016 21:42:20 GMT -8
*Is* it a tragedy when it's just an immature guy doing something stupid? I don't know; maybe so. You could say the same about Romeo and Juliet. Well there's more to Romeo & Juliet than "immature young people fall in love when they shouldn't, then stupidly die, the end" Just like there's more to Into the Wild than "immature guy goes into the wilderness without knowing what he's doing, then stupidly dies, the end" The real depth of the story is all the characters who tried to reach him - tried to address the character flaw that led to his downfall. That aspect is in fact the vast bulk of the story, and is rich with emotion and relatable people & circumstances. I'm not equating Krakauer with Shakespeare, of course. Just making a point.  |
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Post by Sleeping Bag Man! on Apr 23, 2016 21:47:26 GMT -8
BTW the movie is very good, too - worth seeing for the Hal Holbrook performance & storyline alone.
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Post by Lonewolf on Apr 24, 2016 4:21:56 GMT -8
Into Thin Air did not hold my interest; "The Climb" by Anatoli Boukreev. It's his response to Krakauer's book and another perspective of what happened by a professional mountaineer instead of a writer. "Everest, the major motion picture from Universal Pictures, is set for wide release on September 18, 2015. Read The Climb, Anatoli Boukreev (portrayed by Ingvar Sigurðsson in the film) and G. Weston DeWalt’s compelling account of those fateful events on Everest. In May 1996 three expeditions attempted to climb Mount Everest on the Southeast Ridge route pioneered by Sir Edmund Hillary and Tenzing Norgay in 1953. Crowded conditions slowed their progress. Late in the day twenty-three men and women-including expedition leaders Scott Fischer and Rob Hall-were caught in a ferocious blizzard. Disoriented and out of oxygen, climbers struggled to find their way down the mountain as darkness approached. Alone and climbing blind, Anatoli Boukreev brought climbers back from the edge of certain death. This new edition includes a transcript of the Mountain Madness expedition debriefing recorded five days after the tragedy, as well as G. Weston DeWalt's response to Into Thin Air author Jon Krakauer." www.amazon.com/The-Climb-Tragic-Ambitions-Everest/dp/0312206372He died in an avalanche on Annapurna in 1997. |
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Post by ecocentric on Apr 24, 2016 7:09:21 GMT -8
I think that it is a shame that so many people want Chris Mccandless to be some sort of better role model, or is a poor reflection on all that adventure. I wonder if they never took any chances while they were young? Despite the flawed character that touched almost everyone he met personally, and thousands that have only read his story. I think that it should be enough to admonish others to learn from his mistakes. The narrative is deeply introspective for those of us who, like Krakauer, did take chances, might not have survived, and yet emerged more fully formed.
I'm not dissing *Into Thin Air,* it is gripping; a tale well told. I think that it is funny that LoneWolf thinks of one author as a mountaineer, and the other mountaineer that authored a book to be just a writer. Krakauer deserves to be grouped like David Roberts, Bradford Washburn, Galen Rowell, David Breashears and a number of other mountaineers that became great writers, photographers, or film makers because of their experience in the mountains. Krakauer also raises important issues about the practice of mountaineers that climb more like mercenaries, dragging wealthy climbers up some of the worlds most dangerous mountains.
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rebeccad
Trail Wise!
Writing like a maniac
Posts: 12,708
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Post by rebeccad on Apr 24, 2016 8:38:11 GMT -8
The real depth of the story is all the characters who tried to reach him - tried to address the character flaw that led to his downfall. That aspect is in fact the vast bulk of the story, and is rich with emotion and relatable people & circumstances. Now THAT makes me think I might want to read the book. Thanks. |
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Post by hikerjer on Apr 24, 2016 9:15:02 GMT -8
I prefer Into the Wild.
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cajun
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GEAUX TIGERS!!
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Post by cajun on Apr 24, 2016 9:47:43 GMT -8
Into Thin Air. I agree with RebeccaD: Into the Wild was about a kid, perhaps a mentally ill kid, making stupid and ill-informed decisions. I couldn't get through even half the book -- it's one of three books in my entire life that I've started and not finished.
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gabby
Trail Wise!
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Post by gabby on Apr 24, 2016 9:51:24 GMT -8
I haven't read Into the Wild, but I've seen the Sean Penn movie. Perhaps this discussion will lead me to attempt the book.
On the business of the motivation for reading books (or watching movies), much of what both orygawn and ecocentric say is important: I don't read books (or watch movies) primarily to have my world view confirmed or to "be happy," though I often do that too, as well as taking in a lot of "guilty pleasures"/"candy" - probably more than I ever need. There is really no explanation for watching some of the stuff I watch dozens of times - pure fantasy.
My interest in the movie "Into the Wild", much like a lot of Krakauer's stuff, is to experience something that I couldn't otherwise experience or observe firsthand, or to see something from a different perspective. The fate of the guys on the boat in "The Perfect Storm" was related to how humans get into places they never intended or expected, perhaps based on flaws in human character which, like the frog in the slowly heating water, lead them down a path they simply can't foresee - or perhaps don't want to see, given the restrictions and overwhelming drives inherent in being the humans they are. As much as we would like to think otherwise, much of human experience is "of a piece", in the sense that we say "there but for the grace..." - and fate is wanton and unpredictable, respecting no one.
On another level, I found a great deal of "Dead Man Walking" to be disgusting, disquieting and offensive, but it was a great movie. Its exploration of an area I might have otherwise avoided was, in fact, the enticement. That the production was done by individuals whose judgment and skill in film I respect didn't hurt, either.
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gabby
Trail Wise!
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Post by gabby on Apr 24, 2016 9:54:14 GMT -8
a kid, perhaps a mentally ill kid, making stupid and ill-informed decisions ...and yet, pink hair. Not something I would do without some consideration of the level of regret. But, HYOH. |
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Post by Sleeping Bag Man! on Apr 24, 2016 10:14:14 GMT -8
...and yet, pink hair. Not something I would do without some consideration of the level of regret. If you went to Mardi Gras in New Orleans you'd get pink hair too. And sparkles! You probably wouldn't be as adorbz, though. (I'd like to go to Mardi Gras there some day, and do all kinds of things I'd regret. hehe) |
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Post by tipiwalter on Apr 24, 2016 10:23:33 GMT -8
Lonewolf totally gets the picture. I lost respect in Krakaeur for trying to place the blame on some of the deaths to Anatole Boukreev. Who did Krakaeur save? And all the climbers Boukreev saved were not even clients in his group, they were clients in Krakaeur's group led by Rob Hall. Boukreev belonged to Scott Fischer's group and of that group only Fischer died. I believe Krakaeur stay huddled in his tent that night in the South Col after his descent while Boukreev was out in the storm rescuing people. There's a huge discussion of this here--- kenanddot.wordpress.com/2007/03/06/why-does-jon-krakauer-dislike-anatoli-boukreev-so-much/A woman named Wendy makes this excellent comment--- "I definitely think Jon Krakauer singled out Anatoli and Lopsang specifically in his book. Probably this was because they were not in as good a position to defend themselves, one hardly speaking English and one being a Sherpa. No matter what Jon Krakauer thinks of Anatolis methods of guiding here are the FACTS: Anatoli going up the mountain without using oxygen did not cause the deaths of Namba, Hall, Fisher or Hansen. ALL of Anatoli’s clients came out of the situation ALIVE – 3 thanks in part to him going to rescue them. Rob Hall’s clients were ROB HALL’S responsibility and the responsibility of his GUIDES. Why didn’t Mike Groom take Namba and Beck Weathers when he went back to camp. MIKE GROOM abandoned them there!!!! Why did Rob Hall leave Beck Weathers alone for 8 hours instead of getting him back down to Camp IV when Beck admitted having problems??? And then some idiot claims Anatoli should have helped him down. NO ROB HALL SHOULD HAVE!!!! Scott Fischer’s death was Scott Fischer’s fault and no one else’s!!! Scott Fischer had no reason to summit at all – all his clients had summited and came down – he saw them on their way back!!! If he had turned around right away he may have been able to assist Neil Beidelman and also may have survived!!! Doug Hanson’s, Andy Harris’s and Namba’s death were solely the fault of ROB HALL. He is responsible for his clients and trying to force the issue to get Doug Hanson to the summit when it was too late in the day caused him to abandon any other clients that needed help on the mountain. He chose to stay with Doug Hanson which some find commendable but I do not. Doug Hanson should have been turned around at 2 p.m. and Rob Hall with him. Therefore, Doug would not have died, Rob would have been able to help Namba and, most probably, Andy Harris and would have been able to collect Beck Weathers before he almost died and suffered severe frostbite. WHY are these facts NOT mentioned in Krakauer’s book – or rather glossed over. Seems he is more worried about Lopsang short-roping Sandy and Anatoli going down the mountain quickly and not using bottled oxygen. He seems to have no interest in making the ADVENTURE CONSULTANTS GUIDES responsible for the death and injury of the ADVENTURE CONSULTANTS CLIENTS!!!!!!" POST BY WENDY But it all comes down to this question: Who did Krakauer save??? |
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