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Post by Coolkat on Oct 12, 2023 4:14:32 GMT -8
I'm guessing this is covered somewhere in another thread but I couldn't find it.
So I just finished 2 different hikes and on the last one the weather turned really nasty the day after I finished and this got me to thinking. What I if I had to finish my hike in that weather?
The next day the temps were to drop down in the 40s for a high and the winds to pick up to 20s and along with that a bunch of rain. I believe the clothing I had with me would have gotten me through that with no issues but in all my years of backpacking I've never dealt with that cold, that amount wind, that amount of rain all at the same time. I had with me a rain jacket and rain pants. Between my long sleeve mid layer and my puff jacket coupled with the rain shell I'm pretty sure I would have been fine.
But I also know that hiking in a rain jacket for a few hours usually leaves me very wet from my own perspiration under the shell and that would not have been good for my down puff jacket underneath which would probably left me warm until I took off the shell and left me with a perspiration soaked down jacket.
I'm curious from those with more experience in such weather what kind of layering would have used in those conditions. Its one thing to be wet or cold but its another thing to be wet and cold with high wind all at once.
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zeke
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Post by zeke on Oct 12, 2023 4:33:12 GMT -8
No way I'd combine a down layer under rain gear. I think your assessment is correct. It would be soaked.
If I'm moving, any base layer under the rain gear would keep me warm, even just a long sleeved shirt. My rain gear does a very good job at stopping the wind from chilling me, as well as shedding the rain. I'd be soaked from the sauna inside, but that cannot be helped. Opening the zips only lets in the rain.
My main concern would be keeping my other clothes dry while in the pack. A large trash bag is useful for that, and is very light. The other concern, which has yet to be tested by me, is how much water weight would the pack absorb? I have a pack cover, but have yet to confirm it is useful in a downpour.
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texasbb
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Post by texasbb on Oct 12, 2023 6:04:51 GMT -8
No way I'd combine a down layer under rain gear. No way would I ever wear a down layer while hiking at all. And ditto the rest of zeke 's comments. I find it easy to stay warm while hiking in the rain except for my hands. I do best with rain mitts just to keep the cold rain from hitting them (insulated gloves wet out and don't help much), though water does make its way in a little.
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Post by Coolkat on Oct 12, 2023 8:36:50 GMT -8
My main concern would be keeping my other clothes dry while in the pack. A large trash bag is useful for that, and is very light. The other concern, which has yet to be tested by me, is how much water weight would the pack absorb? I have a pack cover, but have yet to confirm it is useful in a downpour. All my clothes and sleeping bag are in a dry bag so I'm not worried about them and I know by experience that my pack cover works well even in an all day rain. I've heard others say that pack covers aren't worth anything but that is all I've ever used and I've had no issues. And this was confirmed on the 1st hike as one of the days it had a steady rain for 2 or 3 hours. I find it easy to stay warm while hiking in the rain except for my hands. I do best with rain mitts just to keep the cold rain from hitting them I did have a pair of lightweight gloves but they were not water proof in the least. Which is something that will change for the next hike. |
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Oct 12, 2023 9:10:07 GMT -8
When it's cold enough, I'll wear a light down layer under a shell while hiking, but the stated conditions are still well above that. I would wear my infamous orange Patagonia R1 hoodie under a shell, over a wool base layer if necessary. I've backpacked a fair bit on rainy days in the 40s and even down into the 30s.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Oct 12, 2023 16:01:32 GMT -8
I just redid the DWR on my OR Foray. Its outside started to wet out in the rain. Made the jacket heavier. It then made better thermal contact on my shoulders. Translation did not feel as warm when it repels.
If it above freezing I don't wear anything heavier than a long sleeve mid weight poly shirt under my rain jacket.
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trinity
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Post by trinity on Oct 12, 2023 17:29:18 GMT -8
I agree with the comments above. Down and active movement involving sweat do not, in my experience, mix well. I would wear my infamous orange Patagonia R1 hoodie In recent years, fleece has gotten a bad rap, but seems to be making a comeback. For the kind of use described by Coolkat , fleece is the perfect mid-layer, IMHO, providing some insulation while breathing well and wicking moisture. I use a MH Microchill Hoodie (long discontinued) or a Kuiu Peleton 97, which is one of the best warmth to weight fleece layers available. I'm hearing more and more about the open-weave synthetic mid-layers (e.g., Alpha Direct), but I don't yet have any direct experience with these. I do best with rain mitts As long as we're on the subject, what do you and others use in this regard? I've been meaning to get some for years, mainly eyeing the offerings from MLD, REI, and OR. Would love to hear any recommendations in this department. |
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Oct 12, 2023 18:00:44 GMT -8
I do best with rain mitts As long as we're on the subject, what do you and others use in this regard? I've been meaning to get some for years, mainly eyeing the offerings from MLD, REI, and OR. Would love to hear any recommendations in this department.
I have REI eVent rain mitts and I like them well enough to always pack them. I just wish they were a little bigger, to better accommodate warmer gloves in low temps.
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texasbb
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Post by texasbb on Oct 13, 2023 6:08:08 GMT -8
As long as we're on the subject, what do you and others use in this regard? I've been meaning to get some for years, mainly eyeing the offerings from MLD, REI, and OR. Would love to hear any recommendations in this department. I have REI eVent rain mitts and I like them well enough to always pack them. I just wish they were a little bigger, to better accommodate warmer gloves in low temps.
I have the same REI mitts and also wish they were bigger, but for a different reason. The largest size is barrrrely big enough for my hands, and doesn't go far enough up my wrist to fit snugly under a rain jacket sleeve. The ability to wear gloves underneath would be a bonus, but only if I could truly keep water from dribbling in, which I'm not convinced is possible without maybe hot-gluing them around my wrists.  |
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Post by daveg on Oct 14, 2023 8:30:20 GMT -8
I have hiked in the conditions you described quite a few times. The worst I recall was hiking seven hours in torrential rain and gale force winds with the temperature in the mid-30s.
I chill easily, so in those conditions, I wear a synthetic baselayer, a fleece mid-layer, and a synthetic puffy (currently a MH Thermostatic jacket) under my rain jacket. Even then, I have to keep walking to stay warm. All the layers are fairly hydrophobic so while they may get "moist" from perspiration, they don't wet out.
I carry a merino wool long sleeve top, baselayer bottom, a pair of socks and undies, and down vest or puffy jacket in a dry bag. Once camp is set up, I change into my dry clothes. If conditions allow, I will wear my synthetic puffy for a bit because it dries quickly from body heat.
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BigLoad
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Post by BigLoad on Oct 14, 2023 9:13:14 GMT -8
Even then, I have to keep walking to stay warm.
Yes, under those conditions it really helps to keep moving and stay fed. A little bit of rain always finds its way through the holes and it's impossible to completely avoid perspiration. I stay warm when I'm moving, but the moisture takes full effect when I stop.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Oct 14, 2023 12:51:38 GMT -8
The worst I recall was hiking seven hours in torrential rain and gale force winds with the temperature in the mid-30s. That's the kind of weather I can see using hiking mitts in. |
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Oct 15, 2023 4:58:19 GMT -8
The worst I recall was hiking seven hours in torrential rain and gale force winds with the temperature in the mid-30s. That's the kind of weather I can see using hiking mitts in. THat’s the kind of weather I do my damnedest to avoid. I heat up a lot when hiking, so will usually hike in a single synthetic layer under my rain gear. That means not stopping for more than a couple of minutes, which I’m usually not interested in doing in the rain anyway. If I stop, I’ll get chilled, and will need to add a warm layer under the rain jacket, which of course will let water in unless I’m in shelter. |
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Post by oldbill on Oct 15, 2023 10:01:15 GMT -8
Great discussion. Can't claim to have mastered my layering system but have hiked a lot in those conditions. I also want to be warm when stopped as well. I have Raynaud's so getting cold in my extremities can get really serious fast. My current system is
Base: long sleeve synthetic shirt (+ Smartwool 250 long sleeve if there is a good chance of rain/highs low-40's)
Mid: R1 or similar pullover (not hooded) - always bring
Rain-gear - Marmot Precip + 1/4 zip pants
Rain mitts: either REI or OR - both over lightweight gloves
Insulation: Arteryx Cerium LT down - use only in camp/stopped
One school of thought is that rain gear is primarily to keep you warm, not dry. Once my Precip wears out I may get one of the non-breathable jackets. Use venting to control heat.
Would have opted for a Smartwool 150 shirt but that's what was available on short notice: needed one on a trip when the weather went downhill more than expected for what I had brought out with me.
Biggest issue is choosing my hiking pants and base for trips where highs range from 60's to 30's. 30's and 40's I really like the SW250 and light fleece/softshell but they're tough to wear when it's sunny, little wind and temps above low 50's! Hiking in cold rain/sleet/modest winds I have been comfortable with the SW250 + R1 + rain gear on less strenuous sections, just SW250 + rain gear for major uphill work.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Oct 15, 2023 14:47:34 GMT -8
Once my Precip wears out I may get one of the non-breathable jackets. Use venting to control heat. Mostly I find that anything over about 25F here on the east coast breath-ability doesn't matter much. The vapor pressure from the humidity doesn't give moisture much reason to cross the membrane. |
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