reuben
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Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 4:59:07 GMT -8
We rarely get enough snow to make them worthwhile, but I've toyed with the idea of getting a pair. I already have a pair of snowshoes I bought on sale a couple of years ago which will finally get their first workout due to the recent Snowmageddonzillapocalypse.
Anywho, those things are expensive! $800 for skis, 600-800 for boots, then poles...
I've been considering a pair of BD Link 105s, which seem about right for a beginner going off trail. Maybe I should just abandon the idea since we rarely get enough snow to make it worthwhile, but I hear that it's a lot more enjoyable than snowshoes.
Recommendations?
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Post by hikerjer on Jan 24, 2016 8:04:04 GMT -8
The kind of ski you've described is a pretty heavy duty backcountry ski designed for some serious turns in relatively steep terrain. You're really looking at a ski that's designed for a combination of backcountry skiing and downhill skiing and they are considerably more expensive. So unless you're looking at the kind of backcountry skiing which really borders on mountaineering, I think they are definitely overkill. You can get a backcountry package much cheaper - around $300-$400 that will probably suit you just fine in the conditions you're describing. I'm not endorsing and particular brand but something like this will probably meet you needs. www.rei.com/product/890932/rossignol-evo-ot-65-cross-country-skis-with-nis-bindings. Check out Sierra Trading Post, EMS, REI and LL Bean for the best deals on packages. I would suggest a BC (backcountry) ski with metal edges unless you're going to be exclusively on groomed trails. Also, get some sturdy boots, not necessarily mountaineering plastic ones, but enough to support you and keep your feet warm. I use this type of set up in all types of trail conditions and sometimes off trail in the Beartooths and in Yellowstone and they work fine. Once you've mastered it, I think you'll really enjoy x-country skiing. Faster, easier and more fun than snowshoeing. Not to say that snowshoeing doest have it's place.
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zeke
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Peekaboo slot 2023
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Post by zeke on Jan 24, 2016 8:10:52 GMT -8
When I bought my first XC ski set, they were Rossignol, and I loved them. I also enjoyed the bumper sticker I bought at the same time. "Give me Rossignol or Give me Head"
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reuben
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Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 8:40:01 GMT -8
Hmmm, so maybe I'm looking at the wrong type. Based or reading that's what I gravitated to. I'll be on ungroomed trails 99.9% of the time. A fair amount could be in the woods, but I can find some open fields as well. Thanks. FWIW searching backcountry.com for "metal edge touring skis" brings up the kind I mentioned earlier. Is there no standard nomenclature? www.backcountry.com/Store/catalog/search.jsp?s=u&q=metal+edge+touring+skis
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zeke
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Post by zeke on Jan 24, 2016 9:05:09 GMT -8
IMO, you don't need metal edges for what you want to do. Any good XC ski will do that. I found my metal edges most helpful on heavy downhill runs, groomed or not. When you want to turn hard, the edges help grab something to turn with. Telemarking is what I was doing, and it works wonders on steep terrain downhill.
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Westy
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Diagnosed w/Post-Trail Transition Syndrome
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Post by Westy on Jan 24, 2016 9:12:09 GMT -8
The primary differences are ski construction type. Single camber or double camber. Single camber is for Alpine Touring using climbing skins for traction up hill and removed when descending. Telemark or parallel turns are used and the binding maybe be a Randonee (parallel) or free heel (telemark). Binding and boots are more robust for telemark and parallel turns. A double camber is used for Nordic Touring and uses wax or a waxless base for grip. Techniques for Nordic include diagonal stride, double pole with an occasional basic telemark turn. All will have various binding configurations. The bindings would typically be NNN or 3-pin. Both would be free heel. The BD Link 105 is a single camber ski. I do not recommend BD skis. Manufacturing processes and controls are inconsistent. The skis mentioned by Jer and Zeke are double camber. I have multiple double camber ski set-ups and boot binding combinations. My favorite and most often used. Fischer E-99 CrownBelow is my neighborhood (high desert) terrain. I should be out there right now. We had 6" last night. Regretfully other priorities prevail.
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reuben
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Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 9:33:33 GMT -8
Westy, that looks like where I'd do almost all of my skiing. I'm way confused on the terminology of what to look for, even though Jer helped narrow it down. I'd ski in fields, parks, even my own land, but it's fairly dense woods and not really conducive to skiing.
Using the same search terms at different sites yield quite different results. I've found a few more FAQs I'm working though. Being a low maintenance kinda guy I'm sure I'd prefer waxless (OOC), even though I'm not sure of the difference.
Thanks.
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Westy
Trail Wise!
Diagnosed w/Post-Trail Transition Syndrome
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Post by Westy on Jan 24, 2016 9:47:11 GMT -8
Waxless skis are the most popular choice because they are convenient and provide grip in a variety of snow conditions. They are called waxless because rather than relying on kick wax for traction, they have a textured pattern in the middle third of each ski that digs into and grips the snow. Despite their name, waxless skis perform best when you apply glide wax to the tips and tails
In the case of dense woods, consider your Nordic skis as an alternative to snowshoes. A metal edge, double camber, waxless Nordic ski has the advantage of energy saving efficiencies. The metal edge can help in side stepping or herringbone.
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zeke
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Post by zeke on Jan 24, 2016 9:52:42 GMT -8
My waxless skis had a pattern on the bottom that resembled fish scales. I found I could spray them with silicone and get more slide out of them, and less clumping. In my years of XC skiing, I kept buying skis that had stiffer camber and shorter scale patterns. I got to where I could ski uphill fairly well, given a little momentum. Not sure I could even stand up in them today.
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Post by hikerjer on Jan 24, 2016 10:30:11 GMT -8
Most x-country skis today are waxless and they are pretty efficient. I do have an old pair of Fisher Europa 99s which are waxable that I still use on occasion. Given the right conditions, waxable skis are more efficient if you know what you're doing. I do sort of miss the mystic and tradition of waxing my skis. On certain occasions, that is. For the type of skiing you describe, you probably don't need metal edges but they are a nice feature to have as has been pointed out in the above posts.
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Post by hikerjer on Jan 24, 2016 10:34:50 GMT -8
These skis are primarily used for downhill skiing in the backcountry. They will have free heel bindings so you can lift your heel when skiing up to the top of an area and then clamp down for the downhill run which is generally the object of the outing. They are heavier and stiffer than the traditional x-country ski. Of course, you would need more robust boots, usually plastic, akin to regular downhill ski boots, and climbing skins to ascend to the heights you ski down from.
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reuben
Trail Wise!
Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
Posts: 11,165
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 10:58:49 GMT -8
Ah, so they're what I DON'T want. Thanks, Jer. Somehow I got onto that type of ski as being what I wanted/needed. Thanks for correcting me.
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Post by hikerjer on Jan 24, 2016 11:25:50 GMT -8
You're welcome. And one more piece of advice, put on a fricking jacket before you go out.
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reuben
Trail Wise!
Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
Posts: 11,165
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 11:36:58 GMT -8
Jer, I stocked up on Pall Mall Menthol 100s and french vanilla creamer. At the very least I'm pretty sure that I can outlast the Miracle Whip militia at Malheur.
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reuben
Trail Wise!
Gonna need more Camels at the next refugio...
Posts: 11,165
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Post by reuben on Jan 24, 2016 11:44:34 GMT -8
Side question - is there any good reason why a newbie like me couldn't use trekking poles (with snow baskets) instead of dedicated ski poles?
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