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Post by 1camper on Sept 11, 2015 14:08:23 GMT -8
I was surprised. Up until then and ever since for that matter, the terrorists attacks seemed amateurish by comparison.
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gabby
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Post by gabby on Sept 11, 2015 14:37:44 GMT -8
They got lucky, but mostly because we were simply not paying attention: Bojinka Plot
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Post by 1camper on Sept 11, 2015 15:26:23 GMT -8
I'd like to see the 28 redacted pages of the 9/11 commission report but this wasn't meant as a political thread. It was one of those events, at least in my mind, that categorize memories into just before and after. My son turned 1 just a month before. I remember thinking that it would be a long war but surely would be over by the time he was an adult. Well, it doesn't look like it now.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 18:34:36 GMT -8
Americans to unquestioning patriotism how an entire people could be driven to the extreme - “just“ from fear! No credit at all to the American public who was so ready to “support our troops“ and all that!! But our collective reaction from this one day? Genocide begins with sterotypes. Not every American fits into your overbroad generalization.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 18:54:07 GMT -8
You could remain defensive and 'patriotic' and resort to nit picking Remain? What makes you think I ever was?
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Post by 1camper on Sept 11, 2015 19:27:10 GMT -8
Ben2world wrote: "Nothing changed with my life from that one day..."
That pretty much answered my question. I doubt very much that it's true..
I'm sure you can think of something. There's a little mom and pop seafood market down the street from my house. On Fridays in season, they used to have fresh yellow fin tuna flown in from Manteo that was caught that morning. $11 lb. For some reason after 9/11 that service stopped and I can't get tuna as fresh and as cheap any more.
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swmtnbackpacker
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Back but probably posting soon under my real name ... Rico Sauve
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Post by swmtnbackpacker on Sept 11, 2015 20:00:50 GMT -8
After active duty and seeing the USSR dissolve in the '80s-'90s, I transfered to the reserves, had a few years in a steady civilian job when the attacks occurred. More grim determination wanting to get those responsible but it quickly becomes mechanical tactics. Everyone called in to volunteer but we weren't needed yet. Mobilized later, finances were ok (officer - divorced no kids), varying assignments (mostly flying the F-13 Desk but did a few months of combat missions when totaled up), did squeeze in a lot of backpacking when stateside ... but, seeing others lose it all to mostly divorce, I put off "settling" w/ a house, et al.. keeping it light. Still feels like some years are missing.
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davesenesac
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Our precious life is short within eternity, don't waste it!
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Post by davesenesac on Sept 11, 2015 22:04:13 GMT -8
A bit off the focused topic, but expect worse might occur in the future. Most of the public has since put their heads back in the sand. With our very open borders thanks to powerful leisure, transportation, and shipping industry corporations that thrive in our open environment, we are still very exposed to some horrible things I won't mention except to say in the weeks after 9/11 I posted a comment on a major news feature on Yahoo that had all manner of usual foul language, genocidal and mean revengeful comments that were not censored. A scenario of what they could do that was maybe the only censored post and probably really scared some in government that read it that did not want to give anyone ideas.
The violent reaction of the United States began a severe blow to terrorist organizations that learned a lesson that comes down to the similar wisdom of not shooting a grizzly bear with a pellet gun. The bear will not suffer much long term injury but rather only get really mad and vent its anger on anything and anyone nearby.
Thus at least at top levels enemies will wait till they can deliver real hurt. That is a reason why military hawks and hard core conservatives are so keen on keeping nuclear weapons out of the hands of rogue states like North Korea and Iran and bottling up their commerce to isolation. Although the public listens to media parrot their weapon delivery systems are still years away from becoming transcontinental, every day hundreds of shipping containers and trucks pass through our borders in both directions with contraband while only a token few are actually opened or X-rayed. Huge stuff like automobiles that are larger than bombs. Much more to add but not fit for this thread.
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Post by 1camper on Sept 12, 2015 5:14:38 GMT -8
Thanks for your service swmtnbackpacker.
I'm pretty conservative politically and I couldn't care less if Iran gets the bomb. That cat has long since been out of the bag. As far as our southern border goes, I think the drug cartels that control it are pretty happy with the status quo and aren't about to let some isis punks ruin it for them. Thinking up terrorist scenarios isn't really off topic at all. Its part of the change that has happened to many of us. Ben brought up perspective. Certainly 9/11 wasn't "America losing its innocence" ..that arguably happened during the civil war. These attacks were shared in real time by the whole world and it was different in that way, reactions were authentic, heroes were obvious and the carnage seemed to eclipse any other attack I can remember.
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Post by Lamebeaver on Sept 12, 2015 8:28:52 GMT -8
every day hundreds of shipping containers and trucks pass through our borders in both directions with contraband while only a token few are actually opened or X-rayed. Huge stuff like automobiles that are larger than bombs. Much more to add but not fit for this thread. I'm a little surprised that something worse has not happened as well. I've got a few theories on why, involving radiation detection surveillance.
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Westy
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Post by Westy on Sept 13, 2015 8:22:23 GMT -8
Maybe this is lame, but true. 9-11 brought forth a realization of how fragile life is, sort of a military experience flash back. Prior to residing in Utah I always rode motorcycles. 9-11 facilitated my decision to buy and ride my Ducati Monster, live life. I have been riding ever since.
It also made me angry. While watching the tragedy unfold on television in our conference room, many of our young engineers where speaking with much bravado about military action against the perpetrators.
I was crying inside, because I knew that military action would result in casualties among our young soldiers, sailors and airmen. It made me sad. I was very unhappy with them because none of them would ever even think about serving their country. The entitlement generation I guess.
Because of that experience I developed my corollary, "He who flies the flag the most, has served the least."
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Post by ecocentric on Sept 13, 2015 13:26:10 GMT -8
I used to cross the Canadian border regularly. Now I don't travel anywhere by air. I left Salt Lake City so that I wouldn't be there during the winter Olympics. Now I live as close to the headwaters of my watershed as I can, well outside the city limits, on a road that is only used by people that live here. I'm not in the least bit paranoid, I just don't want any unnecessary hassles.
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Sept 14, 2015 8:10:53 GMT -8
Reading over this thread, I see a few things that I didn't consider when I first saw the question raised. I don't feel my life has been particularly changed by 9/11, any more than it has by the wildfires burning throughout the West. It's not happening to me. But maybe it does affect some things. I know for sure I won't settle in the urban-wildland interface, and I do give some thought to whether I want to be in large crowds, etc (though that latter probably has more to do with the Boston Marathon bombers). I'm annoyed by the TSA impediments to flying, and sometimes dismayed at how willingly we all queue up to be inspected.
But for the most part, I agree with Ben and others: the world didn't really change on that day, though we maybe became more aware of it. And there is still a lot less dread than there was at the hottest parts of the Cold War, which I am old enough to remember.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 9:27:07 GMT -8
To really do justice to this question, I would have to write an autobiography — something in fact that I did before I was 40 years old — in the form of a full-length novel.
Because of the social activism I pursued when I was younger, the salient details could include the guns held to the back of my head by white supremacists, the "dirty Injun" epithets cast my way when I was a child, the draft notice I got four days before the draft was ended, the jobs lost, the jail-time spent before all charges dropped, the loss of friends, the prolonged poverty, the disgrace I unhesitatingly endured within my family, the incessant warnings from my mother about impending Apocalypse and judgment — even when I was an adult — and so on.
And all this would follow events from Castro taking Cuba, Russian nuclear missiles in the Caribbean, atomic bomb drills in school, the eternal Vietnam War, the assassinations of great men (with all their faults), riots in the cities, protests disrupting colleges, protesters shot by National Guardsmen, Native Americans' stand-off with the FBI near Wounded Knee, not far from home . . . .
And then along comes 9/11 and subsequent wars and some simple mind, securely ensconced in his retirement income, telling me that I should care.
How does all this affect me? I have a very low tolerance for preachers on any soapbox, civil, moral, or mock-religious — especially those comfortably enjoying their retirement, which they dutifully earned by keeping quiet on those very occasions when there was so much that needed to be said. I earned my cynicism in the College of Hard Knocks and with a determination to read some very sobering books.
These song lyrics from the 60s come to mind:
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Post by 1camper on Sept 14, 2015 15:33:43 GMT -8
I suppose everyone's perspective of history is most influenced by the day they were born. Vietnam was over before I had any political awareness. This is the war that my kids face now, so really there is no bigger issue to me. Dylan's version for this thread please:
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