trinity
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Post by trinity on Sept 1, 2021 17:46:24 GMT -8
I'm sure this has been discussed here and elsewhere, but I am wondering what the current thinking is on TP disposal in the back country. I know it depends on the locale. Much of my recent packpacking has been either in desert or alpine locations, where I always pack out my tp. However, I am preparing for a trip to the Indian Peaks, and I'm wondering about the true impact of burying my tp rather than packing it out. I've been really working to avoid single use plastics, so I kind of hate the thought of double bagging my tp, when it might just as easily naturally decompose in a season or two. Anyone know of any good current data on the relative benefits of packing out tp vs. the use of single use petroleum products necessary to do so?
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Sept 1, 2021 18:12:01 GMT -8
I’m not sure anyone has calculated it in quite those terms. I don’t double-bag—single ziplock seems adequate. And I almost always pack it out, because it just seems like most places anymore have too many users to decompose it. What’s more, even buried TP tends to get dug up and dragged out by critters, so your best efforts could fail to keep it underground long enough to decompose.
If you do bury, I suggest getting TP that’s means for RVs. It breaks down faster (of course, mostly because it’s thinner). And you might need to mix it into the, er, organic matter, which can gross out some people.
In remoter areas where camps sit vacant between users, and where it’s wet enough to break it down, fine. In some of the Sierra places we just were, I think we’re on the cusp of either having to install backcountry outhouses or require a “pack it all out” approach. It was hard to find a place to dig a hole at 10,000 Island Lake, because they’d all been dug already (and too many had just stacked rocks on top of their deposits, but that’s a whole other issue).
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Travis
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Post by Travis on Sept 1, 2021 19:06:27 GMT -8
In the Indian Peaks Wilderness, I would continue to pack out used toilet paper. Or consider not using toilet paper at all. (There are ways, if you have experimented.) Whether you visit the website for Indian Peaks or the LNT website the questions become complex enough to avoid any general discussion even for Indian Peaks. Like RebeccaD, I'd restrict myself to one layer of plastic for carry out. I would not expect to find optimum circumstances in the Indian Peaks area for burying toilet paper anywhere, but that is just my view from a distance. Unfortunately I'm not aware of any recent research that might resolve the question any better.
Have a good time there!
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Post by hikerjer on Sept 1, 2021 19:21:35 GMT -8
I pack mine out. I keep my toiletries in an Eagle Creek nylon zip pouch with two plasic baggies. One baggie contains my unused TP along with some hand sanitizer and the other is used for soiled TP. I put the used toilet paper in one of those doggie poop bags, tie it shut and put it in one of the plastic baggies. Then put it in the nylon zip pouch. Never even know it's there.
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Post by hikerjer on Sept 1, 2021 19:26:27 GMT -8
I think we’re on the cusp of either having to install backcountry outhouses I never thought I'd favor this idea, but in many areas I think it's now the only viable soluton. A hassle and expensive but considering the alternative ------
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Post by bradmacmt on Sept 2, 2021 5:45:40 GMT -8
I dig a cathole, and burn the TP before burying it.
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Sept 2, 2021 8:25:30 GMT -8
I dig a cathole, and burn the TP before burying it. I hope to heck you’re jesting about burning the TP. Maybe things are better in your forests, but I can’t imagine anything more insane in the Sierra right now, for example, and CO isn’t any better. Plus, I’ve never found used TP to be all that happy to burn.
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Post by Lamebeaver on Sept 2, 2021 8:32:27 GMT -8
I know it depends on the locale. Some parts of the Indian Peaks see heavy use, but there are a few areas that are less frequently visited. I'd be perfectly OK with a cat hole in those places.
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balzaccom
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Post by balzaccom on Sept 2, 2021 8:48:27 GMT -8
My last backpacking trip in the Sierra included the discovery of several TP "blooms" in the area behind obvious campsites--TP that had been dug up and shredded by rodents.
Please pack it out
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zeke
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Post by zeke on Sept 2, 2021 8:54:06 GMT -8
I've just gotten to the point of packing the tp out in all cases. Once I began bagging the tp where required, it seemed like an easy enough thing to do consistently.
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jazzmom
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Post by jazzmom on Sept 2, 2021 9:46:28 GMT -8
I pack it out. Always. I don't really even think about it anymore. Maybe easier for me because I've always had dogs and have been toting around dog poop in little bags most of my life.
I use dog poop bags for used TP, which I sort of compress and "roll" tightly. I accumulate a few days' worth in the roll (basically until I can't stand the thought of opening it up to add to it) then tie it off. My trips are rarely longer than 7-8 days, so it never gets out of control.
I personally find the whole "soup-making" process to be a LOT more unpleasant.
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Post by cweston on Sept 2, 2021 9:53:13 GMT -8
Like others, I always pack it out. About single-use plastics... Here's how I think about some of these types of issues wrt backpacking: I'm only backpacking a small number of days per year. If I'm concerned about plastic consumption, and I act to reduce mine during the rest of the year, then if LNT concerns cause me to use an extra baggy a few times a year to pack out my TP, my overall impact is still greatly reduced, since my non-backpacking days so greatly outnumber my backpacking days. I apply that same logic to nutrition, etc. If I eat pretty well on my non-backpacking days, then I can pretty-well eat whatever I want without concern on my backpacking days. And so on. I personally find the whole "soup-making" process to be a LOT more unpleasant. I'm definitely NOT asking for any more information about this statement.
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Post by Sleeping Bag Man! on Sept 2, 2021 10:00:49 GMT -8
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Post by absarokanaut on Sept 2, 2021 10:08:43 GMT -8
I haven't backpacked in some time so I pack it out dayhiking. Boondodcking if I have a fire I will burn it and any TP mines I might find. The last two summers saw an alarming increase in the number of TP mines out there.
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trinity
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Post by trinity on Sept 2, 2021 10:10:56 GMT -8
Thanks for some really interesting discussion. Just to be clear, I don't mind packing out TP at all, I find it pretty easy and have been doing it for years. I just hate single-use plastics. But for now, I think packing it out is the lesser of evils. I'm definitely NOT asking for any more information about this statement. I'm guessing she means the pee poop puree method described by Ron Moak some years back? Has anyone tried using a portable bidet? I haven't, but I'm giving more and more serious thought to trying this out. I'd love to hear from anyone who uses one.
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