jazzmom
Trail Wise!
a.k.a. TigerFan
Posts: 3,059
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Post by jazzmom on Aug 28, 2021 16:09:40 GMT -8
So, Big Agnes uses 0.34oz cuben for the body/fly and 0.51oz for the floor. Tarptent uses 0.51oz cuben for the body and 1oz for the floor.
I've played around a little with the 0.34oz cuben to make a rain skirt. I honestly can't imagine making a tent with it. The people I would trust, who have been in the cuben shelter market for a while, e.g., ZPacks, Hyperlite, all use 1oz for the floor.
I have the "platinum" version of the Big Agnes Fly Creek. I bought the 2-person to replace the solo Fly Creek -- same weight for slightly more floor space. I've only used it car-camping so far but I was holding my breath through a super gusty night at Joshua Tree a few months ago. It did surprisingly well even if I didn't get any sleep...
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Post by georgeofthej on Aug 28, 2021 18:22:28 GMT -8
Thank you swmnt, franco and jazzmom; I appreciate your help.
It turns out that Zpacks makes a freestanding single wall dyneema tent, called the Free Duo. I decided on it and went to pull the trigger, but found they don't have any in stock. I don't really have anywhere closeby to use it now anyway, with all the fires in Northern Calif, so I'll wait and see if they have any available later. One concern I have with that tent is this: will condensation drip in the center? The shape of the roof makes me wonder. In one review, a user had a small amount of trouble with a drip, and the other two reviews I found did not mention it. Anyway, while I'm waiting for them to get more in stock, I'll check any new reviews that come out to see if there are problems. Maybe I'll be letting you know what I think of that tent in a couple months if I get one!
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kayman
Trail Wise!
Loving Retired Life
Posts: 200
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Post by kayman on Aug 29, 2021 6:05:28 GMT -8
I replaced my 2007 Tarptent Double Rainbow with the dcf version when it came out last year. So far I’ve been very happy with it.
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Aug 29, 2021 7:38:47 GMT -8
Nice looking shelter, though at first glance I’d wonder if the roof is flat enough to be a snow load issue? Not a dealbreaker for many uses and areas of course. And the generous interior “living space” volume has to have some costs… zpacks.com/products/free-duo-freestanding-tent
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Post by trinity on Aug 29, 2021 9:53:38 GMT -8
It turns out that Zpacks makes a freestanding single wall dyneema tent, called the Free Duo. Somehow I had missed the release of this shelter. Looks like a winner to me, and quite a bit less expensive than the BA tents. I hope you're able to obtain one soon, and I look forward to your review.
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Post by georgeofthej on Aug 29, 2021 20:35:05 GMT -8
I’d wonder if the roof is flat enough to be a snow load issue? Here is what one review said about snow: "The second downfall of the tent is the semi-flat roof. In a Montana blizzard I tested the tent in, by morning there were a good 6 inches of snow piled on top. It was a simple fix — flicking the roof — but it did obscure any signs of daylight alerting me it was time to trudge through the snow once again." www.garagegrowngear.com/blogs/gear-reviews/review-free-duo-tent-zpacks
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Post by georgeofthej on Aug 29, 2021 20:52:17 GMT -8
Of the 3 reviews I read on the Free Duo, this is the only one that mentions the condensation drip concern I have with the flat part of the roof. Regarding condensation: "the steep head and foot walls and long footprint generally keep water off your sleeping bag, although I found that the occasional drip can come off the flatter part of the ceiling." bikepacking.com/gear/zpacks-free-duo-tent-review/It might not be a big deal and I'm willing to take my chances with it at this point.
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Post by georgeofthej on Aug 29, 2021 20:56:23 GMT -8
I hope you're able to obtain one soon, and I look forward to your review. I'll keep my eye out for availability of the tent. If I can buy one, I'm not sure when I'll get a chance to backpack with it. Some of these fires here in Calif are likely to burn for a while. Too much smoke.
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Post by georgeofthej on Aug 29, 2021 21:14:14 GMT -8
I replaced my 2007 Tarptent Double Rainbow with the dcf version when it came out last year. So far I’ve been very happy with it. I'm glad to hear it's working out well. Thanks.
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gabby
Trail Wise!
Posts: 4,538
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Post by gabby on Apr 14, 2024 9:09:57 GMT -8
I was on the verge of creating a new thread to ask a question about "fabrics", but then did something I very rarely do: I searched to see if there was already something out here about the subject FIRST -- and found this thread from 2021.
Challenge Sailcloth (Tarptent calls it (I think) "ultra") -- any opinions?
I've already ordered a new fly for my old fav tent, the Scarp 1, made out of it, as a "sort of upgrade", and I was getting curious about opinions. I've read a little bit about it, and I think I'll like it for its salient properties: doesn't absorb water, doesn't stretch, is lighter than silnylon, etc.
Anyone got comments/opinions?
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Post by swmtnbackpacker on Apr 15, 2024 12:39:33 GMT -8
I was on the verge of creating a new thread to ask a question about "fabrics", but then did something I very rarely do: I searched to see if there was already something out here about the subject FIRST -- and found this thread from 2021. Challenge Sailcloth (Tarptent calls it (I think) "ultra") -- any opinions? I've already ordered a new fly for my old fav tent, the Scarp 1, made out of it, as a "sort of upgrade", and I was getting curious about opinions. I've read a little bit about it, and I think I'll like it for its salient properties: doesn't absorb water, doesn't stretch, is lighter than silnylon, etc. Anyone got comments/opinions? New fabrics? There’s various types of new “ultra” - like ultragrid, ultraweave, and now “ultra x”. Sold to compete with DCF/DCF hybrid, these are used for packs as they’re too heavy for modern UL shelters per square unit. Performance-wise, I was not impressed with my ultraweave pack due to delamination, but resold it anyways due to size. Some long term users tell me it’s fine with a pack liner (seams are the weakness of “waterproof” fabric anyways). Ultra X is the toughest and can resist delam with the right structure, but may be overkill as it’s expensive. Heard good things about ultragrid if it’s “not as waterproof” fabric works at cheaper prices. Now Challenge ECOPAK Ultra is not only recycled but read it’s recyclable too. Not sure how it compares to the other ultras, but may take a look. For trails, plain robic may work just fine. Most of these are based on thickness (denier) and robic tends to be the thinnest. Think it’s recycled too. For shelters, there’s Challenge (iirc) TNT. Kind of between DCF and some traditional fabrics, it’s supposed to be a cheaper choice. Tarptent makes some shelters of this stuff if you’re interested in comparing. Fwiw 0.55 DCF is ok with me if rain will be rare (the tarp or fly stays in the pack mostly); if they brought it back, I’d buy a Zpacks Hex Plus size mid tarp. Ultralight and waterproof it’s now bio-based when it gets too ragged to keep.
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gabby
Trail Wise!
Posts: 4,538
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Post by gabby on Apr 16, 2024 9:21:15 GMT -8
swmtnbackpacker, I was going to copy your entire post, but thought I'd attempt a little "low-leve parsimony". You clearly know a great deal more than do I about the fancy new techy fabrics, however, I was primarily interested in the tent fabrics. I guess I'll get to check out the performance of my new Scarp 1 ultra fly for real sometime this week (or weekend). I've watched a few videos on the fabric, but you don't know until you try it, I guess. It's like wine: I tell people who ask me if a wine is good that "you can't tell until you buy it and drink it" -- everybody's tastebuds are different. Thanks for your response.
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Post by swmtnbackpacker on Apr 16, 2024 11:15:14 GMT -8
.. fancy new techy fabrics, however, I was primarily interested in the tent fabrics. I guess I'll get to check out the performance of my new Scarp 1 ultra fly for real sometime this week (or weekend). I've watched a few videos on the fabric, but you don't know until you try it, I guess. It's like wine: I tell people who ask me if a wine is good that "you can't tell until you buy it and drink it" -- everybody's tastebuds are different. Gotcha. I did not catch where Tarptent was calling their new shelter material “ultra” instead of “TNT”, .. as most others use “ultra” for pack materials (thus far). Looks like Tarptent’s “ultra” (=UltraTnT for “tent n’ tarp”, see link below) reduces the Scarp 1 fly weight by 4 oz over sil-nylon, but probably gives better performance over the older fabric in both rain and sun. UltraTNT is also stronger for a little weight savings 0.94gsm vs 1.0gsm. See below for an article comparing it to other fabrics (silnylon, DCF..). thetrek.co/ultratnt-the-newest-material-for-ultralight-tarps-tents/I know another shelter maker uses it for simple tarps as well. The big cheese has been sil-polyester (more rain resistant/UV resistant than sil-nylon), … but I’d bet UltraTNT is stronger.
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gabby
Trail Wise!
Posts: 4,538
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Post by gabby on Apr 16, 2024 11:36:29 GMT -8
Good article.
Given that I first heard about the use of the material in tents from a source in Britain, your article is appropriate. Maybe the nature of weather in the "peak district" (near the sea, so sudden and violent changes, esp. in winter) is the primary reason for greater interest in the fabric there.
Anyway, thanks again for your responses.
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Post by trinity on Apr 16, 2024 16:51:38 GMT -8
gabby , I'll be interested in hearing your report once you've had some time with the new fly. I don't know anything about this material, but what I do know is that Henry Shires would not use anything he did not have complete confidence in.
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