zeke
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Post by zeke on Jun 10, 2021 5:51:12 GMT -8
Sorry, but sunscreen is not a scam. It works by blocking the damaging rays of the sun. Zinc Oxide based creams will be very effective, both at preventing sunburns and also preventing exposure to cancer causing UV. If you wish to believe otherwise, feel free, but don't bring that unscientific opinion here without expecting blowback.
The body's natural reaction, that burn, is slowed down because the rays that cause the damage are reduced. Properly applied, sunscreen will do the job it is supposed to do, which is to protect you from a sunburn.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Jun 10, 2021 6:07:33 GMT -8
Also if you have sensitive skin or are particularly worried about sun damage both sunscreen and protective clothing should be used. Most clothing, even SPF rated, do pass some sun.
I just went on a overnight trip earlier this week. I did a big application of the Blue Lizard before leaving. I really like it. It feels like it really hangs on without being overwhelming on my skin. There was a lot of lightning issues so my route was mostly low through well canopied areas so it wasn't a good burn test. But with sweat and pouring rain it was a good test of how long it lasts. I did not need to reapply although if I was doing big sun the second day I should. The 10ml tube would be good for a couple of days of touch ups for me. I have pretty sun tough skin.
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jazzmom
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Post by jazzmom on Jun 10, 2021 6:08:48 GMT -8
Like others, when backpacking, I'm mostly in long pants, sleeves. I'll also wear sun-gloves. Sunblock on face, forearms, back of neck, etc.
I've been using Neutrogena "dry touch" sunscreens for a long time and use the same on the trail. It's a non-greasy liquid consistency that's easy to put on, just goes on like lotion, no scent. Comes in various SPFs, including super high ones, but I honestly can't tell the difference in effectiveness above about 45. I'm guessing the nicer tactile characteristics make it less efficient but it's worth it for me hiking when I'm not going to get a daily shower.
For shorter hikes, I transfer some into a small screw-top container.
A couple of years ago, I met the owners/crew at 'Joshua Tree' products through a friend and tried a bunch of their stuff, including their sunblock "sticks". Blech. Hard dense product that you rub on like deodorant. It was impossible to use, IMO.
I've never used spray on, ever. Not even with my kid.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Jun 10, 2021 6:13:03 GMT -8
Comes in various SPFs, including super high ones, but I honestly can't tell the difference in effectiveness above about 45. In my recent research it seems the consensus that any claims of SPF 50 or greater should be questioned. SPF 30 seems like the dependable max.
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Post by Coolkat on Jun 10, 2021 8:19:45 GMT -8
This is something that I've never worried about much but then again I haven't done much hiking out west. Last summer when I did my CO trip I brought some with me but only used it twice I think on my nose. If I am worried about it I usually just pull my sleeves down. I had a hat that covered my neck.
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texasbb
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Post by texasbb on Jun 10, 2021 10:24:01 GMT -8
Sorry, but sunscreen is not a scam. It works by blocking the damaging rays of the sun. Zinc Oxide based creams will be very effective, both at preventing sunburns and also preventing exposure to cancer causing UV. If you wish to believe otherwise, feel free, but don't bring that unscientific opinion here without expecting blowback. The body's natural reaction, that burn, is slowed down because the rays that cause the damage are reduced. Properly applied, sunscreen will do the job it is supposed to do, which is to protect you from a sunburn. Both population skin cancer rates and sunscreen use have been going up over the years. No, correlation doesn't imply causation, but nobody has figured out the correlation as far as I've seen, so the unintended consequences backpackal alludes to would seem to be a possibility, especially since studies of individuals show that "correct" use of sunscreen reduces an individual's chance of skin cancer. Second, the chemicals in sunscreens readily make it into your bloodstream. See here, for example. Quote: all four active ingredients were found in blood samples at levels exceeding the threshold recommended for toxicology testing. The effect of these concentrations is unknown and further studies are needed to determine the clinical significance of these findings.What are those chemicals doing to us? We don't know. Yet dermatologists continue to encourage people to slather the chemicals on, multiple times per day, every day, even under clothes, whether they're outside or not, blah, blah... I personally think that's inadvisable--I might even go as far as calling it foolhardy. Too much of even a good thing can be bad, and my money's on those chemicals being a bad thing over the long haul. backpackal 's advice to prefer textile-based sunscreens and his concerns about false security engendering dangerous behavior changes are not unreasonable in my opinion. "Scam" may be the wrong word, but I don't think it's as simple as skincancer.org makes it sound.
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Post by backpackal on Jun 10, 2021 15:54:39 GMT -8
Sunscreen was invented long ago to prevent sun burn. Only recently, 2012, the FDA allowed the labels to say that it reduces the risk of skin cancer. It does not prevent it. A nice. High SPF shirt is better IMO. To each his own
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rebeccad
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Post by rebeccad on Jun 22, 2021 6:28:32 GMT -8
Unless you plan to have your face fully covered as well as arms and legs (I hike with the latter covered, but have this thing about breathing and seeing), you need sunscreen. Sure, I think it’s better to cover up than use goop, and particularly because having to cover arms and legs with sunscreen twice a day takes a LOT more (heavy) sunscreen. But I lost my dad to skin cancer, and my FiL has been fighting it as well. I’m not going to hang my little red-head’s skin out there without protection. Do I pay attention to the ingredients? Yes, and if CR or the CDC says something should be avoided, I avoid it, and I would certainly be sure to use “reef safe” stuff if I were swimming in the ocean. But I’m not going to ditch the sunscreen entirely, nor do I think it is reasonable to call it a “scam.”
FDA labels are very specific about what products can claim. Sunscreen can’t “prevent” skin cancer, because A) some UVA/ B will always get through (also through your clothes) and B) it’s not a freaking miracle. Not to mention that I could be totally careful about skin protection now and get cancer because I was an idiot when I was a kid (hypothetically speaking, you understand. I actually did a lot less stupid sun stunts than most of my peers because I burned so easily).
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Post by cweston on Jun 22, 2021 7:13:49 GMT -8
I have some refillable soft tubes that I fill with "regular" sunscreen lotion for BP trips. I have found it tougher to get good coverage with spray. I wear a full-brim hat all the time in the BC, so my face/neck are protected pretty well between that and the sunscreen.
I always wear shorts and a short sleeve shirt if the weather even marginally allows for it, so I have to sunscreen up. Fortunately, I am able to successfully avoid prolonged exposure to the sun almost all the time in regular life, so I'm OK with some elevated exposure the small amount of the year that I spend BPing at elevation. If I get to camp early in the day, I usually avoid the sun if at all possible. (Maybe a nap in the tent.) I don't burn particularly easily, so that works for me--YMMV.
Applying sunscreen in camp early in the morning when it's 40 degrees (or less) is NOT one of my favorite parts about BPing, for sure.
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tigger
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Post by tigger on Jun 22, 2021 9:44:03 GMT -8
I prefer sunscreen lotion as the spray doesn't seem to cover as well, despite feeling like I am totally wet afterward. I bring a SPF50 usually. I wipe it on my ears, back of my neck, face, arms and legs (if wearing shorts). Been burned enough times to not want it again...
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Post by cweston on Jun 22, 2021 9:47:48 GMT -8
I wipe it on my ears, back of my neck... My neck, my back...
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Post by swmtnbackpacker on Jun 22, 2021 13:26:10 GMT -8
Sorry, but sunscreen is not a scam. It works by blocking the damaging rays of the sun.. Both population skin cancer rates and sunscreen use have been going up over the years. No, correlation doesn't imply causation .. That’s because the sun-worshiping masses of Boomers have aged. I was a kid in the ‘70s when all the adults were slathering on the sun tanning oil to increase the tan. Remember the commercials showed tanned skin as being healthy. Didn’t help that many Northern European folk come from forest dwelling cultures where there isn’t that much sunlight and it needs to be sought out. Now tans are thought of as damage. It is a natural response to safeguard the underlying DNA beneath the epidermis (“skin”). Look at #3 from UC San Diego … there is no healthy tan. health.ucsd.edu/news/features/Pages/2016-09-06-listicle-10-skin-cancer-myths.aspxWe’re talking San Diego as in still being bikini central (can testify to that). Now people are living longer too so we’ll see the skin cancer (before people died of stomach cancer and before that, probably pathogens before they could die to skin cancer).
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reuben
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Post by reuben on Jun 22, 2021 13:36:06 GMT -8
Sunscreen? Or things that hurt?
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Post by oldbill on Jun 22, 2021 14:45:31 GMT -8
Gloves, long sleeved shirts, and long pants are my go to. I then carry a clear zinc oxide lotion for my face and the back of my neck. Ditto, though I also carry a small stick of Zn oxide in my hip belt pocket for use as I keep hiking. I now also add a full back flap to my sun hat and use sun gloves. My father has melanoma and I've also had a lot of exposure to see the damage emerge. Make annual/biannual visits to the dermatologist. I use so much physical blockers that I could be mistaken for the Joker on the trail!
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