ErnieW
Trail Wise!
I want to backpack
Posts: 9,852
|
Post by ErnieW on Nov 27, 2020 12:07:26 GMT -8
In a recent wish list thread the idea of a backpacking fishing rig came up. I did a bit of research but it appears to be a diverse and somewhat complicated subject. I was hoping members here could help.
First I learned that Tenkara exists. I like it is so simple. light and relatively less expensive. Anyone have any experience with this? In terms of success factor how does it compare to reel based rigs?
My goal would be to eat the fish I catch. I'm not really into catch and release. I know fishing in itself can be very Zen and relaxing but hiking plays that role for me. So I want to know how is cleaning handled? My biggest concern is ending up smelling too good to a bear when I go to bed. Also what do you do with the head and guts? I wouldn't want to pack them out. I would think you would want to leave as much of the bio resources of an aquatic apex predator in place.
Also what would be typical time spent fishing and are there times of day fish just aren't biting? I know salt water bluefish are best at sunrise and sunset typically. Can you take a lunch break, catch and clean some fish (fillet them too?), throw them in a ziplock if its not too hot and safely cook and eat them later?
Thanks in advance.
|
|
|
Post by johntpenca on Nov 27, 2020 12:47:09 GMT -8
Fly fishing isn't rocket science. I've fly fished quite a bit. The main thing is to get the casting down. On the other hand, it is complex from a gear standpoint and relatively expensive re: rod, reel, line and tippets. Also, in brushy areas the backcast will leave one tangled in trees and bushes. Never tried Tenkara, but it seems more conducive for the casual fisherman. Plenty of Tenkara info on the web. backpackinglight.com/forums/forum/off-piste/fishing/1Me personally, in the backcountry I use a UL spin rig. Casting flies I use the bubble and fly approach (google it). The spin rig is also more versatile as one can also use lures (one can do the same with a fly rod with light lures, but it is kind of awkward. Spinning also allows one to bait fish if desired. Trout and bass tend to feed at dawn and dusk or when skies are overcast. They seem to lie low when there is bright sunshine, but that is location and specie dependent. Where do you plan to fish and for what species? No doubt markskor is the one to weigh in here. Edit: this is just my perspective; fishing is like backpacking, what works for one person doesn't work for another.
|
|
digger
Trail Wise!
Flirt harder...I'm an IT guy.
Posts: 42
|
Post by digger on Nov 27, 2020 13:03:54 GMT -8
Where do you plan to fish and for what species? This is key. Fishing is a very mixed bag that the answers to these questions weigh heavily. As far a backpacking in bear country: Cooking fresh caught fish could draw any bear within a couple miles down-wind of you to your area. I would discard the heads/guts quite a bit away from my camp. I wouldn't worry about leave no trace. Insects and other scavengers will ensure there is no trace within a day or two at most. But if you're in a national park or otherwise regulated area, be sure that a) it's legal to fish and consume what you catch and b) you abide by the rules of disposal of the remains. You'd want to avoid touching your clothes at all after handling a fish and make sure to wash your hands thoroughly...you may even rinse your hands, get a couple of hands full of dry dirt and pine needles and rub on your hands then wash again. I wouldn't bother fileting. I'd just scale the fish, remove the head and guts and just cook them whole, skin on, in a skillet with a little oil or spitted over a camp fire.
|
|
davesenesac
Trail Wise!
Our precious life is short within eternity, don't waste it!
Posts: 1,710
|
Post by davesenesac on Nov 27, 2020 14:31:44 GMT -8
If trout food is your goal, then a spin rig as John mentioned is certain to be more productive starting out simply because it is easier, one will be able to fish areas difficult or impossible with a fly rig as the edges of streams and shores of streams tend to have too many trees, bushes, rocks, and other vegetation to snag, plus limited casting range.
As semi-base camping backpackers, we almost always bake/fry fish at lunch after morning fishing when black bears are rarely about and not late day when bears are for more likely to be snooping around. There are different environmental attitudes towards fish guts. In popular places, one needs to be more concerned. In remote wilderness areas we just toss guts in brush well away from our camp area. If one has concern, try siting your camp out of sight at least 100 yards away from lake edges, along streams, use routes, trails as bears don't expect people to camp elsewhere. And go to bed at dusk with lights off instead of making noise talking, running a light beacon, and much worse a camp fire.
Bring some actual soap or detergent to wash smell off your hands (well away from water). For some like this person, ending the life existence of a fish creature is the most negative facet of fishing though since I occasionally eat meat, fish, and poultry having to do so has value understanding that reality of organic life on our planet versus the many in this age that eat large amounts of meat every day without ever having to so. If people had to kill other animals to eat meat there would be a whole lot more vegetarians.
Fishing is often poor at timberline lakes at astronomical dawn and sunrise until sun begins shining down in lake zones because insects, especially fly species, will remain on vegetation where they endure the night cold until sun shines on them. That also means at waters that have high ridges to the east that waters may be rather quiet early morning. Stream trout are more likely active at all times of day. Note there are always a few hungry fish that do feed at sunrise by sucking down flies that are floating dead on water surfaces. Late day fishing is often most active but in the evening dealing with cleaning fish, cooking, and then cleaning utensils can be awkward.
Fish we catch late in the day in the high country where nights tend to be cold are more likely to end up cleaned, Ziplock bagged for use the following day.
|
|
balzaccom
Trail Wise!
Waiting for spring...
Posts: 4,475
|
Post by balzaccom on Nov 27, 2020 14:42:04 GMT -8
I fly fish for trout in the Sierra Nevada. They generally bite more willingly at dawn and dusk---but in the High Country, they will often hit anything that looks like food at any time of the day or night (note that night fishing is illegal for trout in California.) The secrets to successful fishing are basically three:
>> Knowing where the fish are, and where they aren't. Some lakes in the Sierra have been cleared of fish for environmental reasons--they were not native to begin with. Brook trout is lakes can be quite near the shore--thus Tenkara might be an option. Rainbows not so much. And knowing where the fish lie in a stream is even more important. I've often caught fish in the outlet or inlet stream even when I was unsuccessful in the same lake. Trout hold in slack water near a current, so look in pools, behind boulders and trees, etc. And in the middle of the day, they are much deeper than in the early evening.
>> Getting the fly to the fish. Tenkara allows you to dap and drop the fly where you want it--as long as where you want it is within the reach of the rod itself. A traditional fly rod allows you to cast much farther. In a small steam, that really doesn't matter. In lakes, where the fish are often rising twenty to fifty feet from shore, Tenkara will frustrate you.
>> Knowing what flies to use. This isn't brain surgery--and high country trout aren't brain surgeons. A smaller sizes (14-18) Elk Hair Caddis, Black Ants, and a few mayfly imitations are all you will need. Caddis and mayflies hatch underwater, then rise to the surface and fly up into the air to mate. Look for rising fish and you will almost certainly see rising bugs.
As for cleaning and eating them... Remember that trout have relatively few calories...don't count on them for your whole dinner, unless you can better them in butter or bacon. I do not fish where there are grizzly bears. I fish in the Sierra. I leave any fish guts on the side of the creek, far from camp. They are always gone the next day. I simply rinse off my hands in water to clean them of the fish smell. I don't know what I'd do in grizzly country.
Note that in some areas of the country the Department of Fish and Game recommends throwing the guts into the lake or stream. Not in California---and I hate to see fish guys at the bottom of any lake or stream. I'd rather feed the local foxes or fishers...
|
|
ErnieW
Trail Wise!
I want to backpack
Posts: 9,852
|
Post by ErnieW on Nov 27, 2020 15:15:44 GMT -8
I was looking at the rules for NY state. I wouldn't have guessed my idea about carrying the filets from the day to cook that night would be regulated: Regulations for Harvested Fish Fish cleaning law It is illegal on New York State waters to possess walleye, black bass, brook trout, lake trout or Atlantic salmon that have been cut, dismembered, filleted, skinned or otherwise altered so that the species and total length of such fish cannot be easily determined. However, these fish may be gilled or gutted. Other species of fish may be filleted provided that the skin is not removed from the fillets. This regulation allows more effective enforcement of harvest regulations on protected game fish.
Fish Carcass Disposal Law It is illegal to discard any fish carcass, or parts thereof, into the freshwaters of the state within 100 feet of shore or upon any public or private lands contiguous to and within 100 feet of such water, except: On private lands by owners of such lands. If properly disposing into suitable garbage or refuse collection systems or by burial. Where incidental cleaning of fish for consumption is permitted. However, resulting waste may not be disposed of within 100 feet of any public launching or docking site unless into a suitable refuse collection system. Live fish and fish which must be returned to the water because of size limits, open seasons and daily limits are not subject to the fish carcass disposal law.
|
|
|
Post by bradmacmt on Nov 27, 2020 15:18:10 GMT -8
I'll go along with everything John wrote. While I have a 4-piece fly rod, I never use it instead relying on an UL spinning outfit for catching fish to eat. Tenkara is quaintly appealing, but for real eating the spinner is where it's at. As John pointed out, a few flies with a bubble isn't a bad idea. A 4-piece 6’-6” pack rod, with reel and a small assortment of spinners is all a guy needs. I think my entire fishing kit is under 11 oz's. All my highcountry fishing is in Grizzly country. I absolutely will not cook on a pan. The fish go into the coals wrapped in foil. 5 minutes per side. Fish parts go into the brush, well away from camp.
|
|
|
Post by bluefish on Nov 27, 2020 15:49:27 GMT -8
I've backpacked and fly fished NYS for 50 years. Lots of pond and stream choices in the southern dacks. Tenkara is good for small waters and you have skill at being stealthy and reading water. Chucking bait and spinners is the best bet for putting fish in the pan. Stocked ponds and lakes are best for that. If you need some destinations, Ernie, just ask in a PM , I will not put these places in a public forum. By the way, I'm bluefish for a reason, I've caught them to 17 lbs. on the fly. I love to saltwater fly fish and chase striped bass up and down the coast.
|
|
ErnieW
Trail Wise!
I want to backpack
Posts: 9,852
|
Post by ErnieW on Nov 27, 2020 17:10:53 GMT -8
By the way, I'm bluefish for a reason, I've caught them to 17 lbs. on the fly. I love to saltwater fly fish and chase striped bass up and down the coast. I grew up on Mamaroneck harbor. I was just telling my 8 year old twins that I was going out in our rowboat by myself at their age to chase bluefish when they were running. 17 lbs was also the largest blue I ever caught. I was also telling them we preferred snappers and tinker blues because they are more tender and not as "oily". Money was tight when we were young so we were encouraged to bring home whatever seafood we could. We even deep fried spearings. Crunchy treat but mostly they were bait for snappers.
|
|
|
Post by johntpenca on Nov 27, 2020 17:23:59 GMT -8
I have no clue about fishing north eastern waters; my fishing knowledge is mainly based on fishing the sierra. Seems like bluefish is your best reference. I second the used of longer rods. Mine is 6'-6" as well. They cast better. Short rods don't cast very well.
|
|
|
Post by swimswithtrout on Nov 27, 2020 19:12:28 GMT -8
Supper, Montana style...Brook Trout fillets from a lake with a standing kill order to prevent them from moving down stream. We did our part...
|
|
|
Post by johntpenca on Nov 27, 2020 19:23:52 GMT -8
Wild brookies are my favorite eating fish. Tasty little things. Always wanted to fish for the big ones in Canada. Dave, that photo makes me hungry.
|
|
|
Post by Lamebeaver on Nov 28, 2020 7:43:45 GMT -8
Most of my backpacking trips involve fishing. I use a four piece Diawa 7' rod, and a Shakespheare UL reel loaded with 4lb line. I carry an assortment of lures in a Plano mini-magnum case. I wash my hands well after filleting, and throw the heads and guts as far into the lake as I can.
|
|
ErnieW
Trail Wise!
I want to backpack
Posts: 9,852
|
Post by ErnieW on Nov 28, 2020 8:01:58 GMT -8
Wild brookies are my favorite eating fish. Tasty little things. Always wanted to fish for the big ones in Canada. Dave, that photo makes me hungry. That looks amazing swimswithtrout. Would you mind telling us what kind of fishing rig you used for that bounty? Also do you use a little oil in the pan or just cook them straight in the non-stick pan?
|
|
ErnieW
Trail Wise!
I want to backpack
Posts: 9,852
|
Post by ErnieW on Nov 28, 2020 8:08:00 GMT -8
Most of my backpacking trips involve fishing. I use a four piece Diawa 7' rod, and a Shakespheare UL reel loaded with 4lb line. I carry an assortment of lures in a Plano mini-magnum case. I wash my hands well after filleting, and throw the heads and guts as far into the lake as I can. Generally do you catch your fish somewhere near your camp or catch them when you have access then cook them later? Is dinner shortly after catching the fish no matter what time of day? I don't know if something delicate like trout has to be cooked right away.
Particularly when solo camping I have been aiming for very low scent at camp. I sleep better. Sometimes I have been having "dinner" late in the afternoon then hike some more then just a snack at camp. Near no food smells in the area of where I am spending the night.
That guts approach is evidently against the rules in NY.
|
|