davesenesac
Trail Wise!
Our precious life is short within eternity, don't waste it!
Posts: 1,708
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Post by davesenesac on Mar 2, 2020 21:44:15 GMT -8
This evening while walking in a dark bedroom, I stepped on my Marmot Pinnacle sleeping bag and it went POP like stepping on a balloon. Turned on the light and found about an 8 inch long ripstop nylon fabric tear. This is a 15 degree 800 goose down fill bag I bought in spring 2010 so about a decade old. My records show 33 backpacking trips of 170 days and many more nights out in the Forester or roadside tented during road trips. Last year during one backcountry trip, it also suddenly tore a similar hole for what seemed no reason. Both then and tonight, crudely repaired it with 3" wide Gorilla tape, a very messy task and now have about a square foot of black tape on the bag.
I've never washed the bag as I keep it clean. As someone that jumps in creeks and lakes, I almost never get in the bag dirty and when I do say during a storm situation, would at least be wearing under clothing. So all the expensive down inside is still in good condition especially after watching how a bunch of down around the tear was floating around in the air with the slightest air disturbance.
Am wondering if the nylon shell has weakened due to UV damage putting the bag out in the sun occasionally for a few hours to air and dry out? Of course anyone that occasionally sleeps outside cowboy style will sometimes wake up to dew atop nylon just as it does on tents. Am wondering if I'll be out on the trail next summer when an even worse nylon shell tear occurs making for an unrepairable disaster.
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jazzmom
Trail Wise!
a.k.a. TigerFan
Posts: 3,032
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Post by jazzmom on Mar 3, 2020 4:00:58 GMT -8
Have you contacted Marmot about this? I think most owners would report things like this to the manufacturer so, at least, they would be able to tell you if it's something that happens (and maybe why) or if you have a special bag that's possessed.
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Mar 3, 2020 6:13:31 GMT -8
Yep. Commonly known UV breaks down plastic. And at high elevation unfiltered UV is fierce. I’ve read warnings on ultralite shelters that direct not to leave them up during daytime.... Had it happen to my Traiwise Chevron largely in the hood area. Did a couple of patches and then just accepted it was too brittle to be relied on. Though it took a few more decades than yours. Annoying because it’s still got major loft.   ETA: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UV_degradation#Prevention
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Mar 3, 2020 6:38:57 GMT -8
My home lighting has messed with the color (the above photos are closer to its vivid blue) but the multiple patches starting with the first professionally sewn one are clearly visible...that’s blue ripstop Kenyon tape. Good stuff, I’ve a patch or two on a Sierra Designs 60/40 parka that have stayed largely in place for decades. 
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davesenesac
Trail Wise!
Our precious life is short within eternity, don't waste it!
Posts: 1,708
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Post by davesenesac on Nov 15, 2020 11:31:36 GMT -8
With my above sleeping bag shell disintegrating, did my homework yesterday online for current down sleeping bags in the 5F>20F range so this morning ordered from REI this below Aya 15 women's model by Nemo, a $390 list price model. REI had it on sale for $293 and I then received a special 20% online purchase code discount plus a 10% REI membership discount plus had $30 of REI credit so only $225 after taxes.
Perusing all the websites and information noticed there are significant reasons to be very careful selecting down sleeping bags in this online era as there are many products with mediocre specs being sold for high prices mixed in with valid pricing. Especially important to look at actual down fill weights, fill power ratings, and industry standardized temperature ratings versus manufacturer ratings. Probably many sleeping bags are sold in sporting goods stores by look and strong bright colors without people understanding product issues.
The women's size is fine since I am just a thin 5'6". The light metallic color might as well be gender neutral and will allow some modest custom marker artwork. Have a rotisserie sleeping style usually turning each time I wake up and most often just use sleeping bags blanket style while sleeping atop my short Z Lite pad until wee hours when I might get inside and zip up. Will report back here after it gets shipped and use it a bit.
NEMO Aya 15 Down Mummy Sleeping Bag - Women's Regular - Right Zip Aluminum/Aqua Item # 1847070001
Tested Lower Limit 17 degrees (F) - EN Tested Comfort 17 degrees (F) - EN Temperature Rating (F) 17 degrees (F) Temperature Rating (C) -9 degrees (C) Weight 2 lbs. 1 oz. Shell 20-denier ripstop nylon Zipper Location Right Insulation Type Down Premium 800 FP down (RDS) Certified Water-Resistant Down Yes Fill PFC-free down Fill Weight 1 lb. 3 oz. Lining 30-denier nylon taffeta Sleeping Bag Shape Mummy Fits Up To (in.) 66 inches Shoulder Girth (in.) 58 inches Hip Girth (in.) 54 inches
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swiftdream
Trail Wise!
the Great Southwest Unbound
Posts: 528
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Post by swiftdream on Nov 15, 2020 11:59:43 GMT -8
I recommend Kenyon tape over Gorilla tape for a good piece or gear like that. Kenyon tape sticks super well and far more flexible than Gorilla or even Tenacious tape. It looks much better than Gorilla by far.
Had a Marmot Zeus tear at the back of the shoulder and my local outfitter sent it to !armot, told me a sewn patch was about 15 bucks. Marmot would not patch it and wanted $80 to sew a whole knew back panel. I said just send it back. Patched it with Kenyon and well over 10 years later it is the same as the day I patched it, looks good, tape all in place.
Yes. Nylon can do that with sun rays. It can also do that by pressing to violently hard on a baffle. That is why care is so important when washing it. Apparently stomping it in the dark ain’t so very good either.
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crawford
Trail Wise!
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.--Edison
Posts: 1,775
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Post by crawford on Nov 15, 2020 15:19:50 GMT -8
Speak to me more about this tape. Is it nylon? Cloth? Do you need scissors to cut it to shape?Where did you get it? I'm certainly going to Google this but I'd love to here direct from someone that used it.
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swiftdream
Trail Wise!
the Great Southwest Unbound
Posts: 528
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Post by swiftdream on Nov 15, 2020 16:35:15 GMT -8
Kenyon tape is ripstop nylon that is backed by a peel off paper. You do cut it and round off the edges with scissors. It is much lighter and less bulky than duct tape. It comes in various colors and a small role. I keep a roll on hand but only take a small folded piece in my repair/FAK/fire kit, a very full service kit but still light and minimalist, here. The Kenyon tape is good for a small tear in a down jacket mostly. I don’t wear a puffy hiking but things still happen close around camp. This is the full list of the kit; Pocket Kit; Mini Bic Fatwood Cotton ball Ferro rod Dram of tea tree oil Cotton swab Scissors 2x2” gauze pad 33” first aid tape 2 butterfly closures Safety pin Nylon upholstery thread 4 sewing needles 600 grit sandpaper Duct tape Kenyon tape Allen key for BD pole locks Mini compass 
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Post by johntpenca on Nov 15, 2020 16:51:17 GMT -8
Seems to me the shell material is defective. I have 30+ year old down bags that are still good to go except for some delamination of the gore tex. They have been used hard and left in the sun plenty.
I'd send it back to Marmot for replacement. I've had isues with Marmot bags in recent years; seems their QC of their foreign suppliers is not up to snuff.
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swiftdream
Trail Wise!
the Great Southwest Unbound
Posts: 528
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Post by swiftdream on Nov 15, 2020 18:13:04 GMT -8
Here is a photo of some I’ve got on hand. I’ve used all my black Kenyon and need to get more. 
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swiftdream
Trail Wise!
the Great Southwest Unbound
Posts: 528
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Post by swiftdream on Nov 16, 2020 9:44:33 GMT -8
Here is an example of a patched Patagonia Nanopuff pullover, a garment that has disappointed me with its durability. This was patched at the elbow last winter and worn a lot after. First the area was cleaned with denatured alcohol and dried before laying down the patch. Never had a Kenyon tape patch come up at all yet. That’s why it has a place in my on board repair kit while in the wilderness. 
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Post by Lamebeaver on Nov 16, 2020 10:51:33 GMT -8
I don't know if it's UV damage....it could be that the shell material is just getting old. I can't say specifically why, but I know that in Colorado, O-rings tend to crack and get brittle if exposed to the atmosphere...even if they're not left out in the sun. Ozone? I'm not going to pretend I know, but some materials just don't last that long. I have a TNF down bag that's been washed a few times, and is at least 40 years old, and it's still holding up well. YMMV.
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Nov 16, 2020 19:47:53 GMT -8
Here is an example of a patched Patagonia Nanopuff pullover, a garment that has disappointed me with its durability. This was patched at the elbow last winter and worn a lot after. First the area was cleaned with denatured alcohol and dried before laying down the patch. Never had a Kenyon tape patch come up at all yet. That’s why it has a place in my on board repair kit while in the wilderness.  It’s my experience that rounding the corners as shown nicely in your example is a key step. I’ve never had a patch fail when rounded, while longer ago corners left square I’ve seen start to lift.
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rangewalker
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Agitate, organize and educate.
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Post by rangewalker on Nov 17, 2020 1:42:52 GMT -8
My records show 33 backpacking trips of 170 days and many more nights out in the Forester or roadside tented during road trips. Yep, that is a long exposure record fro any product, and I am going to assume at significant elevation. I have lost or retired a number of tents and two packs from solar radiation, or I like to call it, sunstroke. No sleeping bags yet, but that may be because I have a fleet of different bags and none see that level of service. I have seen some old-timers sell their ancient bags for their fill to the DIY crowd. A lot of that pre-China down was premium Eastern European origin.
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Post by High Sierra Fan on Nov 17, 2020 14:46:40 GMT -8
UV destruction of plastics (nylon) is very real. We use high intensity UV lights to area sterilize the interior of our biological safety cabinets within which we do the sterile cell culture work. Lightweight plastic tubes left in for moderate lengths of time just falls part at the slightest pressure. “ Nylon (all types) Unpigmented resins will degrade upon exposure to sunlight evidenced by discoloration and embrittlement. Formulations containing carbon black particles provide the best UV stability.” www.sdplastics.com/ultravioletresistance.html
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