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Post by fiddler1 on Feb 1, 2020 10:12:04 GMT -8
I haven't been to the Winds since 2006, but my kids are finally old enough (9, 12) for a big trip there. Woo-hoo!! Little did they know, all those trips to get them hooked on backpacking were in preparation for this moment. Started dreaming and came up with a plan: Big Sandy - Hailey Pass - Lizard Head - Cirque - Jackass Pass. Side jaunts to Pyramid Lake/East Fork Valley and Baptiste Lake. We'll take our sweet time to break up the miles, and have 2 days to rest/play. Probably 9 days total (7 hiking). Then I realized - this would be most likely to go smoothly in August. But we can't easily go in August, or even late July. Our hiking window starts July 7th. Uh-oh! If 2020 is another big snow year, I guess we go to the Sangres... But I started wondering how often these dates would be possible. For example, here's a trip report from Great Outdoor Shop in 2013 (low snow year) and they made it over Hailey/Washakie in late June without the need for an ice axe - 3 weeks before my dates. I went through my old photos and found pics from about July 12th in 2005 (snowpack melted out quickly that spring). Patchy snow above 10,500 ft in Stough Creek Basin, but not an obstacle. So I'm basically wondering how often my July 7th start date would be feasible and still allow for a low-risk approach for the kids (stream crossings/passes). And yes I remember the mosquitoes. After looking at a bunch of May/June snow data for previous years, I'm guessing maybe 1 out of every 4 years or so? I guess I could just watch the snowpack until May and then decide. Looking at May/June info from Basin maps 2013-present and Snotel reports 1997-present. Crossings - I need streamflows to be past their peak. Kid legs need to get across safely, with the help of two adults as needed. Passes - Hailey Pass doesn't look scary if we find similar early-season conditions described by Great Outdoors in 2013 - "one big snowy glissade fest. We did not use our ice axes, as the snow was in top condition." Not sure what is at the bottom of that snow patch, though, in case we find it to be icy. Jackass Pass is lower. Lizard Head Plateau might have some big snowy patches in the early season. Picture: Stough Creek Basin on about 7/12/05 from about 11,500 feet. Small snow patches above 10,500.
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Post by oldbill on Feb 1, 2020 17:03:17 GMT -8
It sounds risky to me. The streams are usually near peak in early July. Washakie should be ripping. A mishap coming down fast on Hailey might risk injury unless they are used to glissading with a pack. Slow going on Lizard Head due to snow conditions might risk getting caught in afternoon thunderstorm. Also, icy/snow covered boulders on Jackass might be an issue. You know about the mosquitoes. I guess the question would be whether this would be a mostly positive experience for your kids.
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Post by fiddler1 on Feb 2, 2020 7:04:30 GMT -8
The streams are usually near peak in early July. Washakie should be ripping. A mishap coming down fast on Hailey might risk injury unless they are used to glissading with a pack. Right, that doesn't sound good. Which is why I am in agreement that in a typical year early July would be sketchy. My post probably rambled too much to be clear - what I was getting at was: how often do things melt out 2 weeks ahead of schedule, so July 7-15 resembles late July? I understand Hailey could be steep or icy and we'll assess that. I haven't been there so I would love to see some instructive pics of the north side, with dates. The kids are down with glissading. They did this entire snowfield in the Rawahs 3-4 times before we had to insist on going back to camp. They also have stood up pretty well to pushing physical/emotional limits. As long as we have plenty of time and some workable plan/alternatives if we need to bail. We went up Uncompahgre when my youngest was 7 and they tackled this tricky section just fine. Kids are natural scramblers. We go really slowly in stuff like this and talk about the risks a lot.
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Post by cweston on Feb 2, 2020 14:56:29 GMT -8
I think you have it about right: it probably takes about a 25th-percentile snow year to accelerate the normal seasonal schedule by as much as two weeks.
In terms of how SNOTEL data are reported, I guess that would be roughly 50% of normal snow depth or SWE. If the numbers are in that range throughout the spring and early summer, then you might expect conditions to be two weeks ahead of typical schedule.
I agree that stream crossings would be my number one concern. High passes with too much snow/ice can be aborted and a good trip usually still enjoyed. But dangerous crossings are often in the lower country, potentially forcing a difficult decision before the trip has hardly begun.
I was in the Winds in early August this past summer (a very heavy snow year). The mosquitos were bad, but past their peak. I'm guessing that early July of an early snow year could be pretty brutal.
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Post by oldbill on Feb 3, 2020 7:58:37 GMT -8
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Post by absarokanaut on Feb 3, 2020 18:57:07 GMT -8
We ahould be warmer and drier West of the Divide as Spring progresses. While the East side of the Divide typically consdierably more moisture in the Spring it is often AWESOME in earlier July. As a possible punt Ross Lakes hiking Whiskey Mt. may not be your classic Winds Trip but combined with Bomber Basin, etc., it would be magic for those kids. This was Whiskey Mt. July 5, 2011; the year of "No Spring." You could add other area lakes and you could also do a second trip along the South Absaroka Wall, my favorite place on Earth. July that same amazing snow year. I love the Sangres, favorite range in Colorado. Not conducive for loops but truly amazing.
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rangewalker
Trail Wise!
Agitate, organize and educate.
Posts: 1,029
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Post by rangewalker on Feb 6, 2020 8:18:05 GMT -8
Then I realized - this would be most likely to go smoothly in August. But we can't easily go in August, or even late July. Our hiking window starts July 7th. Uh-oh! fiddler1 I love your post and questions....then your research. Plan and Prepare! Oh but if more did applied this level of thought and then outreach. I live in the region, about four hours of away and cannot add to the discussion better than the previous commenters.
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Post by fiddler1 on Feb 6, 2020 12:04:59 GMT -8
A good thread last year followed the developing trail conditions in the Winds. Quite a few photos from early season. Lots of good info and informative pics on that thread and forum in general. Especially the pics of Hailey Pass from July 2019, I was encouraged to see it didn't look too intimidating. As a possible punt Ross Lakes hiking Whiskey Mt. may not be your classic Winds Trip but combined with Bomber Basin, etc., it would be magic for those kids. I forgot about that one, I remember being up Whiskey Mountain one year and we saw tons of bighorns. Glad I was able to park at the top of the jeep road and avoid the first steep, hot climb. If I remember correctly there is some off-trail scrambling around Ross and Bomber? I would have to look into how gnarly that gets before committing. That Absaroka pic looks amazing! The mosquitos were bad, but past their peak. I'm guessing that early July of an early snow year could be pretty brutal. Ugh! We are stuck with our schedule this year, better to go and be eaten alive than to not go at all!! Thanks all for your input.
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Post by larrys on Feb 6, 2020 14:20:54 GMT -8
I have done the Winds to Island Lake in the second week of July and not had an issue. However the week before the traverse around Little Seneca Lake was under water and would have been very dangerous. I have hiked to Skull Lake only to be turned back in early September with big snow fall. We went to Squaretop Mountain area on the north side and had no issues. Day hiked from there and did some exploring and made our trip work out.
Unless they are getting a really heavy snow year my guess is that you could find some places to hike/camp. Maybe the higher passes would be too risky but at least you should be able to get out and enjoy the mountains.
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Post by swimswithtrout on Feb 6, 2020 17:32:47 GMT -8
I've made many trips into the Winds, starting as early as July 10 and snow is generally not a "major" issue during an average year. Stream crossings can get "a bit" sketchy. The mosquitoes can be counted on, however, to be overwhelming.
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Post by absarokanaut on Feb 8, 2020 15:13:47 GMT -8
For the option file: Those lakes are rugged. I was just thinking hiking Whiskey from the trail enroute and then down to the lakes and fishing/frolicking 2nd day and then out 3rd day. I can give you details of a half dozen 11,000'+ dayhikes on the other side of the valley in the Absaroka to fill out some great boondocking or overnights. Stream flows could still be an issue but often are not and I know you want an extended backpack but if you have to I think the Upper Wind River Valley is an awesome place to punt. If the Pinnacle Trail is open the loop around with Kissinger Lakes is like 16 miles with 3 mile roadwalk at the end unless you can shuttle vehicle there. Depends on what Spring brings but here is mid July 2008 which I think was a deent snow year. Doing this loop the peak view in that photo of the Tetons is 2 miles and about 1,800' vert of awesome off trail from near the begining or end of the loop. Amazing wildlife here. Dense Grizzly concentration.
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Post by cweston on Feb 10, 2020 7:13:54 GMT -8
absarokanaut , one of these days I'm going to take you up on your advocacy for the Pinnacles area. Looks like a lot of nice off-trail terrain to the NW of Bonneville Pass, too. Seems like that would be the place for big views of the Pinnacles and the Tetons, right?
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Post by absarokanaut on Feb 11, 2020 8:58:12 GMT -8
I don't know how to highlight posters names like you have here CW. Could you fill technomoronman here how its done? I think we are friends on facebook. I have photo galleries entitled "Point 11,1555'" "South Summit Point 11,245'" and more in the area. The photo of my friend Barret coming out of the trees is on the 11,155' hike and the other hike is the ridge left side of the bowl in the background. Kissinger Lakes is the other side of that hike. Here Barret and her husband are descending 11,155'. Up on south summit point 11,245. Also great views down at Kissinger Lakes from here. You might also check out album "Point 11,894'" That is more remote, approached from Five Pockets or with permission in the Dunoir Valley.
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Post by hikingtiger on Feb 11, 2020 10:20:33 GMT -8
I don't know how to highlight posters names absarokanaut, along the top of the reply box, there is an icon with the '@' symbol and a generic human figure. Click that, begin typing the user name, and then choose from the pop-up options.
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Post by absarokanaut on Feb 11, 2020 10:36:50 GMT -8
Thanks man!
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