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Post by Coolkat on Sept 10, 2019 5:39:21 GMT -8
Right now the costco in my area has a really good deal on a Garmin eTrex 30x which is a significant upgrade from my 10. However, at the point of trying to decide maybe to ditch the gps idea altogether and just take a my phone (since it would serve more than one purpose) and put an appropriate app like GAIA or Backcountry Navigator Pro and use that.
The downside to that is at least me guessing without experience is that it also means that I'll need to bring some of kind of battery backup/charger and together with the phone seems like the weight would be significant vs just having the 30x plus a couple of extra lithium batteries.
What do you good people use? Phone only? GPS only? Pros? Cons? Any recommendations one way or the other?
And no, these are not replacing my map & compass.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Sept 10, 2019 8:57:58 GMT -8
If I were still doing remote off trail trips I would consider just GPS. They are by far tougher, more water resistant and batteries last much longer than a cell. GPS would also be stronger indicated if I was somewhere without cell signals. A lot of the extra features of a phone are lost then. I wouldn't use my cell for recording routes. Too much battery use. A GPS does that easily.
But now I am a weekend warrior hiking trails in civilized areas. A phone and a charging pack are what I have been carrying. In case the phone stops working I do carry a map and compass. Being able to use one of several good mapping programs to suit my needs is nice. With a GPS you are locked into whatever user interface it has.
So for me the answer is for right now is phone only. If I needed/wanted a GPS with me then I would probably still be taking my phone along but would skip the charging pack and keep the phone off mostly.
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Post by ukpacker on Sept 10, 2019 10:28:27 GMT -8
For backpacking I use Garmin 401 as back up to map and compass, when I am stumped I switch the GPS on for a grid ref then switch it off,the GPS takes longer than my phone to find the sattelites but as mentioned previously the 2 AA batteries last months used this way and so far it has proved virtually waterproof and tough enough to drop on rocks. I do most of my backpacking using foreign maps which all utilise different grid map datums, so far I have been able to find the correct datum wherever I have used the Garmin, with a phone I need an app to convert lat long to grid co ordinates but have so far failed to find one app that works simply. Sometimes I have bought downloadable maps for the phone through Viewranger app to show a wider area than I would want to carry on paper maps but I still bring the GPS.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2019 17:36:50 GMT -8
paper map & compass, with gps backup, for the reasons stated above. Never even considered using my phone.
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Post by Lamebeaver on Sept 10, 2019 18:40:34 GMT -8
I have an Android phone and use Avenza. It's free, and so are the maps.
As far as the phone: 1. Put it in airplane mode. 2. Enable location 3. Airplane mode will disable bluetooth, but also disable as many bells and whistles you can such as screen roation. 4. Enable battery saver mode, which will idle most apps background functions unless you specifically enable them (don't).
I've found the battery lasts a long time if used in this fashion. YMMV.
I never carry a GPS anymore.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Sept 11, 2019 4:19:39 GMT -8
I have an Android phone and use Avenza. It's free, and so are the maps. As far as the phone: 1. Put it in airplane mode. 2. Enable location 3. Airplane mode will disable bluetooth, but also disable as many bells and whistles you can such as screen roation. 4. Enable battery saver mode, which will idle most apps background functions unless you specifically enable them (don't). I've found the battery lasts a long time if used in this fashion. YMMV. I never carry a GPS anymore. Very good post. One small detail, some maps do cost money in the store. I have an Avenza version of the NY-NJ trail conference maps for Harriman park. I think they were $12. One Avenza trick I have been using is choose Open view in Google Maps from its menu. Then once it opens in Maps I do a long press on my location and then pick Share. I can then SMS/txt message my location to my wife or others. Why I like this is that if I leave my phone on(not in airplane mode) in the head of my pack where I have poor coverage the messages will go out when I happen to pass through a reception area. You can do this directly with Google maps on your current location but if I center with Avenza the place I am going to then do this I can send that info. No way I have found to do that with Google maps. They don't show enough.
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Post by Coolkat on Sept 11, 2019 6:23:04 GMT -8
I never carry a GPS anymore. This is why I was asking. I'm considering doing the same thing and putting the money used towards a gps instead for a new lens for my camera In reality if I can find a map app that will give my coordinates in utm I should be all set. At least that is how I'm thinking right now.
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Post by tigger on Sept 11, 2019 8:42:58 GMT -8
I honestly just need my coordinates as I prefer to use paper maps for navigation. I can use my phone app and get those coordinates just fine. As referred to above, I put my phone in battery saver mode, airplane mode and shut off all features not needed. My last trip, after four days of use including stopping to take videos and pictures aggressively, I still had 20% of my battery life left. I still like having my old Garmin ETrex as backup in winter, primarily due to toughness of it. It doesn't even have map capability and takes 15 minutes to get satellite lock often, but simply works. I've considered upgrading to a new one, but I don't need/want any of the bells and whistles. I just want my coordinates and the ability to put in waypoints and mark coordinates. I don't need breadcrumbs, or built-in maps. Heck, I don't even use the maps in my phone app. Thanks for the heads up on the Avenza app. I've been using Gaia forever but the last time I tried to start it, they apparently changed to a new lease method vs. the lifetime license I had before. I'm not paying a monthly fee for renting software.
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toejam
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Post by toejam on Sept 11, 2019 9:13:12 GMT -8
Next week I'm out for 8 days and carrying my phone (happens to have 4 gps apps), a small battery that will charge it twice, an InReach, and a real map and compass.
A satellite communicator is much more useful than a Garmin ETrex.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Sept 11, 2019 9:30:53 GMT -8
There is a another class of apps that are just GPS utilities for the phone. I had used them in the past to figure out what was going on with the GPS of a previous phone years ago. The ones I used would let you see the raw stream from the GPS chip not that many would also need that. They should have the abvility to display your current location in a number of different coordinate systems. I can't tell you what a good one would be now but I came up with the following to give you an idea: utm-coordinates.allbestapps.net/There are probably similar ones for iPhones but probably cost knowing Apple stuff.
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Post by cweston on Sept 11, 2019 10:02:28 GMT -8
Is Avenza Android only? If so, is there a similar iOS program?
I have actually never used GPS: I'm old-school (map & compass) and I like it that way. But I always carry my phone (usually deep in the pack somewhere) anyway, because I have learned from experience that if you have to make an unplanned retreat, you're really going to want to have your phone with you when you hit the front country somewhere other than where you planned to/parked the car.
So, as long as I'm carrying that weight, I'd like to learn how to use a phone GPS app as backup, and as a way to double-check location when I'm not sure if I'm where I think I am on the map.
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Post by Coolkat on Sept 11, 2019 10:19:16 GMT -8
I honestly just need my coordinates as I prefer to use paper maps for navigation. I can use my phone app and get those coordinates just fine. This is kinda of where I at and am thinking. I just need to know where on the map where I'm at. ErnieW, I appreciate the link coming from someone who has done this before. It's interesting to see you people mentioning Avenza. Last month I was out for a quick long weekend and ran into a family (of 7) on the trail. Parents and 5 kids ranging from about 6 to 16 or so. The father was using Avenaza to help assist them knowing distances and etc. After reading what you guys are saying... I'm definitely putting the money towards a camera lens instead.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Sept 11, 2019 11:28:25 GMT -8
Is Avenza Android only? If so, is there a similar iOS program? Yes on iOS www.avenza.com/avenza-maps/Easier to learn more on your computer.
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Post by dayhiker on Sept 11, 2019 13:54:57 GMT -8
I mainly use iPhone these days, with GAIA I get allot of good maps, even in the PNW where I have maps on my old Garmin, I am using iPhone. One problem with iPhone with the battery is turning off all the things that make it use it. Also looking at the screen allot uses up power (screen uses allot of battery) This means the battery can drain down allot before you know it. So I usually bring a 13000mAH or 16750 mAH battery which will charge my iPhone 5x! Hopefully by then I have figured out how to slow down the battery drain. I also have bad-elf.com/pages/be-gps-2200-detail which gets very good battery life, even with tracking turned on. And it can be downloaded to GAIA very quickly in the field. These are used by pilots, I got one for my iPad which does not have GPS. I thought I lost one, and got the PRO+. Its display of accuracy is easy to read, but is not accurate! My Garmin was more accurate in heavy tree cover on a Portland hills.
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ErnieW
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Post by ErnieW on Sept 11, 2019 16:14:09 GMT -8
I was wondering how those packs could charge your phone 5x. I never realized how small iPhone batteries are. The 5x is only about 1500 mAh. My new Samsung is 4000 mAh.
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